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Today's topics:
* How do I create an instance of a composite templated upon a different type? -
1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/b487fd0198c68359?hl=en
* How to learn software design - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/3904738778c6ce86?hl=en
* Q: Free compiler for 64 bit Windows 7? - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/5f665081d6a6b15e?hl=en
* Exception Misconceptions - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/cbcc4582e3daf8ee?hl=en
* Run-Time Library Question - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/99e73fab7ac10f83?hl=en
* Exception Misconceptions: Exceptions are for unrecoverable errors. - 3
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/786cfdf0ab25866d?hl=en
* How do I write what the friend template function in template class? - 2
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http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/422bace48aaa5de5?hl=en
* Math/CompSci Interview Question - Thoughts? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/a1cffd71c99a2dd0?hl=en
* Choose to use compile time or dynamic run time for big array. - 2 messages,
2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/71068d5147ffd25a?hl=en
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http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/ce7254f5012a0db0?hl=en
==============================================================================
TOPIC: How do I create an instance of a composite templated upon a different
type?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/b487fd0198c68359?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 2:27 pm
From: "mat"
I am creating composite objects from various building blocks. This is best
described with an example.
template <class T>
class Behavior
{
public:
virtual void DoSomething(T& t) = 0;
virtual void AddChild(Behavior<T>* child){}
};
//------------------------------------------------------------------
template <class T>
class CompositeBehavior : public Behavior<T>
{
list<Behavior<T> > children;
public:
virtual void DoSomething(T& t) = 0;
virtual void AddChild(Behavior<T>* child){children.push_back(child);}
};
//-------------------------------------------------------------------
template <class T>
class SelectBehavior : public Composite<T>
{
void DoSomething(T& t) ;
};
//-------------------------------------------------------------------
template <class T>
class ConcreteBehavior : public Behavior<T>
{
void DoSomething(T& t) ;
};
So I create a composite out of these building blocks.
Behavior<Dog>* pDogRoot = new SelectBehavior<Dog>();
pDogRoot ->AddChild(new ConcreteBehavior<Dog>());
pDogRoot ->AddChild(new ConcreteBehavior<Dog>());
I'd like to be able to create an instance of this composite as though it was
created using a different type, say a Cat, but without going through the
process of creating it all over again by hand (the composites can get
complex). Ideally I'd like to be able to pass some function pRoot and it
return an instance created for the specified type.
Behavior<Cat>* pCatRoot = MakeInstance<Cat>(pDogRoot);
How could i go about doing this? What design patterns might be relevent? (is
it even possible?)
Many thanks for any help.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: How to learn software design
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/3904738778c6ce86?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 2:31 pm
From: James Kanze
On Dec 22, 9:26 am, ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
> In article <hgoo4v$lk...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
[...]
> Real programmers are those, who DON'T ship!!!
The actual quote is "real programmers don't eat quiche".
But of course, programmers how don't ship are quickly
unemployed.
> Those, who "ship" write the crappiest code there is.
That's perfect nonsense. All professionals deliver code.
> Why?
> Well, simply because they have no time to do it forever being
> under pressure to "release" and are being forced to do a 3
> month worth of work in 3 weeks.
And that's also nonsense. Release dates are only established
after discussion with the programmers, and take issues like code
quality into consideration.
> Their documentation sucks. It does not tell you anything
> useful.
Then the product doesn't get through review, and doesn't get
released.
> Their code sucks.
> And their sharks called VPs and CEOs are nothing more than
> viciouse sharks, whose only interest is to suck as much blood
> from anything that moves as they can manage.
> Their customer support sucks and at the biggest and baddest
> places is simply non existant.
> Their "interpersonal skills" suck becaues of "fear of
> survival".
> They are, on the most part vicious, utterly inhuman idiots,
> driven by the complex of inferiority.
> Clear enough?
> Or you need more?
Obviously, you've never worked at any professional companies.
--
James Kanze
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 4:00 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <491907a8-813c-4f53-a053-81f1a38b3158@r5g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>, James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Dec 22, 9:26 am, ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
>> In article <hgoo4v$lk...@news.eternal-september.org>,
>> ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
>
> [...]
>> Real programmers are those, who DON'T ship!!!
>
>The actual quote is "real programmers don't eat quiche".
>
>But of course, programmers how don't ship are quickly
>unemployed.
>
>> Those, who "ship" write the crappiest code there is.
>
>That's perfect nonsense. All professionals deliver code.
True, and that creates the whole industry to hire other
"professionals" that forever fix that stauff.
So, everybody remains gainfully employed.
And that helps. You need a few bux in your pocket once
in a while.
:--}
>> Why?
>
>> Well, simply because they have no time to do it forever being
>> under pressure to "release" and are being forced to do a 3
>> month worth of work in 3 weeks.
>
>And that's also nonsense. Release dates are only established
>after discussion with the programmers, and take issues like code
>quality into consideration.
I know, I know.
Heard those "discussions" before.
The way they usually go is:
"we have 3 months to release this thing"
and not a single person on the whole team does even know
what is involved and what kind of nasty details are going
to popup.
Pretty often, when they tell me their "dead" lines,
I say, oh shitski, this is going to be a trip!
>> Their documentation sucks. It does not tell you anything
>> useful.
>Then the product doesn't get through review, and doesn't get
>released.
Not necessarily.
You think there is some kind of "panel" from God,
omniscient that produces the objective and realistic deadlines
and specifications? Never seen anything like that.
In about 90% of all cases, just to be safe,
what I saw is either UTTER abscence of documentation
or such arrogant and such useless inline statements,
that most of it is just an insult and has no practical use.
>> Their code sucks.
>
>> And their sharks called VPs and CEOs are nothing more than
>> viciouse sharks, whose only interest is to suck as much blood
>> from anything that moves as they can manage.
>
>> Their customer support sucks and at the biggest and baddest
>> places is simply non existant.
>
>> Their "interpersonal skills" suck becaues of "fear of
>> survival".
>
>> They are, on the most part vicious, utterly inhuman idiots,
>> driven by the complex of inferiority.
>
>> Clear enough?
>
>> Or you need more?
>Obviously, you've never worked at any professional companies.
Well, I gave you a list already. One more time:
Intel.
HP.
SGI.
Amdahl.
Hal Computers (Fujitsu)
and a few others, right smack in the middle of silicon valley.
You've got something MORE "professional" that that?
Who are you kidding?
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Q: Free compiler for 64 bit Windows 7?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/5f665081d6a6b15e?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 2:33 pm
From: "Alf P. Steinbach"
* tanix:
> In article <RKKdnft88JlPiazWnZ2dnUVZ_sti4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>> tanix wrote:
>>> In article <Re2dncsqjrDaXa3WnZ2dnUVZ_tZi4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker
>> <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>>>> arunix wrote:
>>>>>> What about asking in a Windoze newsgroup?
>>>>> Because its gcc based compiler.
>>>> Oh, of course: a gcc based compiler for Windows isn't a Windows compiler.
>>>>
>>>> Sigh. gcc is just as off-topic as Windows.
>>> What is this "off-topic" bullshit?
>>>
>>> Have you heard of cygwin?
>>>
>> Yes, I'm familiar with cygwin. It's just as off-topic in this newsgroup
>> as "gcc" and "Windows compilers".
>
> Who ARE you to dictate things like these to some of the most intelligent
> people one can find and whose brains function well above average?
Pete is the one actually writing (editing) the C++ standard.
I think Pete's wrong about the topicality; at least discussions about available
C++ tools and GCC as an answer would be on-topic by the [clc++m] charter and
moderation guidelines, as I see it (both James Kanze and I are moderators
there), and assuming that my evaluation of that is correct, it would be a little
incongruous to regard it as off-topic in this group, which lacks a charter!
Btw., it's amazing what kinds of people you meet on the net. ;-)
Cheers & hth.,
- Alf
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 4:19 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <hgrhcm$5ba$1@news.eternal-september.org>, "Alf P. Steinbach" <alfps@start.no> wrote:
>* tanix:
>> In article <RKKdnft88JlPiazWnZ2dnUVZ_sti4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker
> <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>>> tanix wrote:
>>>> In article <Re2dncsqjrDaXa3WnZ2dnUVZ_tZi4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker
>>> <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>>>>> arunix wrote:
>>>>>>> What about asking in a Windoze newsgroup?
>>>>>> Because its gcc based compiler.
>>>>> Oh, of course: a gcc based compiler for Windows isn't a Windows compiler.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sigh. gcc is just as off-topic as Windows.
>>>> What is this "off-topic" bullshit?
>>>>
>>>> Have you heard of cygwin?
>>>>
>>> Yes, I'm familiar with cygwin. It's just as off-topic in this newsgroup
>>> as "gcc" and "Windows compilers".
>>
>> Who ARE you to dictate things like these to some of the most intelligent
>> people one can find and whose brains function well above average?
>
>Pete is the one actually writing (editing) the C++ standard.
Oh, shitski!
Then I Have to put him back on the expert list.
Who knows, he might say something useful once in a while.
Ok, we'll do that. I can't let my ego stand on the way of information.
>I think Pete's wrong about the topicality; at least discussions about available
>C++ tools and GCC as an answer would be on-topic by the [clc++m] charter and
>moderation guidelines, as I see it (both James Kanze and I are moderators
>there), and assuming that my evaluation of that is correct, it would be a
> little
> incongruous to regard it as off-topic in this group, which lacks a charter!
Well, I just thought about this about half an hour ago,
and would like to mention it here.
It is GREAT that there exists a parallel, "moderated" group.
That means THIS group is not going to be taken over by those
"moderators", who, for some strange reason think THEY are the
ultimate reference on that, which IS and which is NOT.
Most of the "moderators" I had experience to deal with
are simply sick, power obscessed dictators, PERVERSELY
affecting the information flow with their lil ego trips.
It has been a disaster to what happened to Usenet.
Usenet is the LAST resourse left to mankind that is not dominated
and censored to the point of suffocations.
No web forums or blogs can provide uncensored discussions.
No IRC will do that.
Just because of this central concept of totalitarian dictate
called "moderation", where the MOST immoderate people end up
decidin on what kind of information all others are to see.
The decay of Usenet is probably the biggest disaster there is.
And I would advise ANYONE to do whatever they can to make sure
Usenet never dies.
For one thing, Usenet is the MOST robust, fully distributed
system, that supports and delivers ANY kind of information
conceivable, whithin the limitations imposed by the highest
level dictators, such as Jim Skirvin, one of the most despicable
and most evil people in the entire history of "big-8".
He has a key and HE decides which groups are to be created and
which groups are to be removed. And this pervert went to the
ultimate level of totalitarian sickness, and created a group
news.admin.moderation, meant to discuss the issues of this
ugly "moderation" thing, and made it "moderated", where HE
is the "moderator", and that sucker is the most immoderate
nazi I saw to date more or less.
Yes, when people publish some commercial stuff to buy this and that,
that is clearly an issue. But even there, there is nothing you can
do about it, more or less.
But you never know which discussion may fade away into what,
and what may come out of it. And you never know who is going
to be interested in seeing what kind of information or deciding
to participate in it.
Because this is HIGLY subjective.
Furthermore, I, personally, think it is a pitty that C++ has been
fragmented as badly as it is, to the point of obsene.
What IS the problem if someone talks about HIS version of C++,
be it GCC or VC or anything else for that matter?
You ALREADY have threads. If you don't like some thread
becasue you think you are a world caliber "scientist" and
YOU define what C++ is, then do not read that stuff.
But do not prevent OTHERS, who do want to read that stuff
from reading it.
I think it would be MUCH more beneficial if ANY C++ related
discussions could be conducted on a single forum.
You can easily create things like [GCC:], or [VC++] in the subject
header just like they do all over the place.
And instead, if you can not discuss threads, or GUI aspects
or ALL sorts of other things in one place. Because it is considered
to be "unclean" by some "experts", that, for some strange reason,
can not even slow down the relative decay of C++ as a language
as it is being replaced in more and more cases with dynamically
scope languages.
Again, your house is on fire. Nothing less than that.
>Btw., it's amazing what kinds of people you meet on the net. ;-)
>Cheers & hth.,
>
>- Alf
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== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 4:26 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <RKKdnft88JlPiazWnZ2dnUVZ_sti4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>tanix wrote:
>> In article <Re2dncsqjrDaXa3WnZ2dnUVZ_tZi4p2d@giganews.com>, Pete Becker
> <pete@versatilecoding.com> wrote:
>>> arunix wrote:
>>>>> What about asking in a Windoze newsgroup?
>>>> Because its gcc based compiler.
>>> Oh, of course: a gcc based compiler for Windows isn't a Windows compiler.
>>>
>>> Sigh. gcc is just as off-topic as Windows.
>>
>> What is this "off-topic" bullshit?
>>
>> Have you heard of cygwin?
>>
>
>Yes, I'm familiar with cygwin. It's just as off-topic in this newsgroup
>as "gcc" and "Windows compilers".
You don't OWN this group
and it is not your private kitchen.
And you are not an authorised controller of the global information
streams, no matter how big of a fart you think you are.
I just hope that people with your mentality can really offers
some contribution to the language without creating the totally
perverted verions of all sorts of mechanism, just because of their
sadistic tendencies.
It is a pitty people like you are involved in language design
and definitions. You look like a power hungry politician to me.
I doubt you can contribute to the language anything of real power,
beauty or flexibility it so badly needs, at least from now on.
Because its days are numbered in more cases than not.
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Exception Misconceptions
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/cbcc4582e3daf8ee?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 2:53 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <fc93ba82-f199-40b3-a7fd-71c24c7d2b07@u7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Dec 22, 12:48 am, ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
>> In article
>> <a65d3221-02ca-4a18-907f-9027cce07...@c34g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, James
>> Kanze <james.ka...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>> >> Well, THEORETICALLY, it can happen even without using
>> >> exceptions. In reality, it is just a joke.
>> >It's no joke. It's an everyday reality. Most of the phone
>> >switches and transmission systems go back to a time before
>> >exceptions, and they work. Year in, year out, without
>> >interruption.
>
>> Yep. No argument there. Except those apps are infantile
>> by todays standards.
>
>They were a good deal more complex than anything I've seen
>written recently.
Well, I did not mean it to be an insult. Trust me.
But just to put things in perspective.
The rate of coding is orders of magnitude higher nowadays
and complexities also.
And I will never agree with you on exceptions,
even though it is not a matter of principle for me.
I just saw WAY too many benefits of it and WAY too many cases
where they made things MUCH simpliers, much more predictable,
and much more structured.
My "granularity" argument still stands.
You don't need to get lost in the forest by dealing with
never ending collections of trees in front of you.
I can call it a "granularity benefit", whether it makes sense
for you or not.
>> If you tell me I have to write my code WITHOUT exeptions, I
>> won't take your job offer. Sorry.
>It would depend on the context. If they had a good reason for
>not using exceptions, then OK. Otherwise, no.
Well, I would simply feel uncomfortable doing ANY job,
unless it is a kernel mode driver, where rules of the game
are quite different.
But I would feel like I am working in "unclean" environment,
and I would intuitively feel horrified with ALL sorts of
crappy code and orders of magnitude more load on my brain
just because I have to deal with every single return code
on every single non significant level.
Once you decide to go with return codes, that's it.
You have to test EVERY SINGLE return code.
You can not make ANY assumptions.
If I EVER find something that does not need to return the
return code, because, for example, I solved it differently,
I immediately rewrite the called routine so it does not
return any return codes, just for the purity of code's sake.
>> I do not know why some claim the exception mechanism is so
>> inefficient even in cases where there are not exceptions, but
>> that is another matter.
>Memories of early compilers?
Well, I am probably not seeing the picture YOU are seeing.
But I am just curious: what is the essense of argument
that the exception processing, under non exception conditions,
can possibly incure a significant enough overhead to even
bother about it?
Is it a memory allocation/deallocation issue?
Sorry to mentioni Java again, but since I started working with
Java as my primary language, I just do not recall a single case
where exceptions were inefficient.
I do keep a constant watch for performance issues, because those
are VERY critical in my case because most of the "jobs" I run
run for hours, if not days. Just saving a couple of hours of
job processing time, it helps quite a bit.
>> I can only guess that if you want to get TOO sophosticated and
>> assure that you can unwind the stack even considering the on
>> heap allocations and things like that, and, as a result, have
>> to save all sorts of things prepairing to run the exceptions
>> bound code, may be.
>
>I'm not sure which side of the issue you're looking at above.
>From the language point of view, it's clear what has to be done,
>and techniques exist (and are used in most compilers) which have
>0 overhead (or almost) in the case when an exception isn't
>thrown.
That's IT then. That is ALL I want to hear.
In my case, once exception is THROWN, then fine, take ALL the
time you need and use ANY resources you need to make it as
informative as you can manage, if it is a major operation
and user might not know the state of the whole thing and
have to waste hours if not days to recover.
All the other lil exceptions, such as string to number conversion,
simply become a part of the flow. The exception handling overhead
is totally insignificant. Because, first of all, those things
happen EXTERMELY rarely, and if they do, an you have to deliver
a defalut value because your conversion failed, which is slow
enough as it, then it is a totally non issuse. Nothing even worth
mentioning.
> From the programmer's point of view: if you have to
>write any special handling in C++, you're not writing idiomatic
>C++. But one of the more frequent errors I've seen in Java is a
>missing finally block,
Well, that is true. I do agre on this one.
I do try to keep an eye on these kinds of things for vast majority
of cases and never let it slide.
Actually, I use the "finally" quite extensively,
because I need to keep a good handle on my memory allocations/
deallocations issues. Cause I may end up holding hundreds of
gigs of memory unnecessarily for unnecessarily long periods of
time.
> when there are things that have to be
>cleaned up, and the author didn't think about exceptions.
Well, that comes as a skill. Sooner or later they will learn,
or loose their job. THEN they WILL learn for sure.
>> Who knows?
>
>> >> For one thing, without exceptions your code becomes a huge
>> >> pile of spegetti code and I know what I am talking about.
>
>> >Apparently not,
>
>> Apparently yes.
>
>I've worked on some very large projects without exceptions, and
>the code was not at all a pile of spaghetti. It was, in fact, a
>lot cleaner than a lot of code I see today, with exceptions.
Well, to tell you the truth I am not prepaired to argue this
point right now. It seems to me to be self evident.
Just a simple fact:
Do you have MORE logic in your program if you use return codes?
Or LESS?
How much MORE logic do you have?
Well, I estimate AT LEAST 30% of your code, if not 300% for the
sake of artument, has to handle that code. Otherwise you are
just a fool that created codes that are useless since you are
not using them.
I could probably spend a few minutes of my time to give you
a pretty typical piece of code with exceptions and the same
exact code without exceptions.
It'll look like night and day in terms of code clarity
and the size of that code.
But I am getting too much wrapped up into this "exceptions"
or "no exceptions" trip. I AM wasting too much time and
energy on it.
Why do I even need to try to prove anything to someone,
who thinks otherwise?
Stoopid of me indeed.
>> I just wrote too much code to make such a statement. It is
>> simply inevitable.
>
>So inevitable that it doesn't take place.
:--}
Yep, I know your style by now.
Enjoy.
Cya.
>I'm tempted to say the opposite. Exceptions are just another
>tool. A very convenient and effective one in specific cases,
>but still just a tool. If you can't write clean code without
>them, then you can't write it with them. Like any tool, they
>don't change your native ability; all they do is make some
>things (that you could do anyway) easier and less effort.
>
>> > because I've worked on very large code bases,
>> >without exceptions,
>
>> Again, this is a general purpose statement that does not
>> prove anything.
>
>It's the exception that disproves your claim. (Obviously, I
>can't post the code here, because it was propriatory. And
>because it was several million lines of code, which would make
>for a pretty large posting.)
>
>> Either you do test of your return codes, or you don't.
>
>> If you decide to do, and your logic runs to check all the
>> codes, then your code size and the amount of spagetti is
>> probably at least 30% bigger.
>
>That's only if you don't know how to write code.
>
>> With exceptions, you do not check ANY return code
>> more or less. Clear to a 5 year old what it means.
>
>Yes. That you're not handling a lot of errors the way they
>should be. There aren't that many errors which warrent
>exceptions. Most should be processed immediately.
>
> [...]
>> >> Sorry. I can not agree with you on this one.
>> >> I think you are somehow predisposed AGAINST exceptions.
>> >Not at all.
>
>> Yes you are. I have seen some of your posts.
>
>Then you know that I'm not against exceptions. That I use them
>when appropriate.
>
> [...]
>> > and we still managed to write robust and
>> >maintainable applications.
>
>> Well. I am not saying it is not possible in PRINCIPLE.
>> I am saying it is a royal pain on the neck.
>
>It's more effort, that's for sure. But there are a lot of
>other things with even more impact.
>
>> In fact, I will make this claim:
>
>> If you do NOT use exceptions, you are just a lazy bum.
>
>Or you're working in a context where they aren't appropriate,
>for some reason. (On a really small embedded system, for
>example.) But I do use exceptions. I also use return codes,
>assertion failure, and deferred error checking (as in iostream
>or IEEE floating point). I have more than one tool in my tool
>kit, and I use which ever one is most effective for the job at
>hand.
>
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organized by major topics of language, tools, methods, techniques.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Run-Time Library Question
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/99e73fab7ac10f83?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 3:09 pm
From: Christian Hackl
Immortal Nephi ha scritto:
> I believe that all global functions come with Run-Time Library are C
> programming.
No, not all of them. For example, std::getline is pure C++.
> The programmer includes <stdio.h> if they want to use
> printf function. Why do C++ programming offer <cstdio>? Is it for C
> and C++ legacy?
http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/coding-standards.html#faq-27.4
Note that many developers here still prefer <stdio.h> over <cstdio>.
Just browse archived postings for discussions on this topic.
> Do all string functions from Run-Time Library are already included in
> <iostream> and <string>?
<string> and <string.h>/<cstring> are very different headers. <string>
is a pure C++ header that is included for using the std::string class,
while <string.h>/<cstring> contains C functions for char* manipulation.
If you need functions for working directly with char*, then you need
<string.h>/<cstring>. However, in C++ those functions are less relevant
than in C because you have std::string.
> Do <iostream> and <string> have missing
> functions such as isdigit() and isalpha?
No.
> Or are they already included
> <cctype>?
You cannot count on automatic inclusion of other headers.
> I guess you may not recommend to use C and C++ legacy. Use Standard C+
> + Library instead of Run-Time Library.
You've got a runtime library, anyway! :)
Also, <stdio.h>/<cstdio> etc. *are* part of the C++ standard library as
well. So what you actually meant to say was "use pure C++ functionality
instead of C components". Generally, yes. But there are exceptions, of
course.
http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/big-picture.html#faq-6.16
--
Christian Hackl
hacki@sbox.tugraz.at
Milano 2008/2009 -- L'Italia chiam�, s�!
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Exception Misconceptions: Exceptions are for unrecoverable errors.
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/786cfdf0ab25866d?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 3:15 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <091743a1-e305-4cee-b65d-1fe82fc2b0f7@z41g2000yqz.googlegroups.com>, James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Dec 22, 3:15 pm, "dragan" <spambus...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>> Saying "Exceptions are for unrecoverable errors" seems to
>> imply that they are to be used only or mostly in such
>> situations.
>Maybe, maybe not. It probably depends on what whoever is
>saying it means by "unrecoverable". (But I've never heard
>anyone say it, so I don't know the context.)
I like that one!
You do have a style and insight more than most people I saw.
That is why whenever I end up seing some articles while verifying
sites, and there is thread I am looking on, and there is article
from James Kanze, THAT is the article I am going to read first.
That is pretty much guaranteed.
To tell you the truth, I do not have even a concept of
"unrecoverable" error. Unrecoverable errors occur ONLY if my
box dies more or less.
In that case, exceptions or mental masturbation about them,
means as much as a dead mosquito fart. We are screwed.
But, as soon as I reboot, ALL I need to do "to recover",
is to push a SINGLE button. Since even the operation and ALL
its parameters will be automatically reloaded. Cause it is
all as persistant as it gets.
Not a big deal. I lost a couple of minutes of my time
and had a chance to go take a leak, instead of being glued
to the screen. What a pleasure!
:--}
>> Whereas the exception machinery in C++ was developed primarily
>> to handle and RECOVER from more errors more elegantly than was
>> possible without exceptions, the statement is highly suspect.
>
>It depends on the error. At the lowest level, where a simple
>retry suffices, exceptions complicate error handling.
I do not agree. Sorry.
You DO have this tendency...
:--}
Ok, how do you retry a network connection?
You sit in some dumb loop and keep doing the same stoopid
thing, and you might have to do several things during
the connection process depending on what kind of protocols
the sever supports, and whether you need to do authentication
and what kinds of authentication methods sever supports,
or whether sever returns tens of codes, some of which may
be temporary off-line conditions to be retried.
Some may be permanent errors.
Some may be resource issues, and you name it.
So, to me, I just give a dead flying chicken what kind of
error server might have. There is only 2 level granularity
of exceptions.
I do not check ANY return codes more or less.
I can be thrown on two levels only, at most 3.
And ALL that funky logic does not have to be there.
Yes, I understand that your program does need logic.
Otherwise it is just a dumb state machine, even though
the very logic is already wired in into that state machine.
After all, they do execute conditional jumps depending
on which input bit is active.
>> Those "unrecoverable errors" are probably the things that
>> assertion checking weeds out during development time rather
>> than being an application for exception machinery.
>
>If that's what is meant by "unrecoverable", then exceptions are
>certainly not for unrecoverable errors. In such cases, it's
>important (in most applications---there are exceptions) to kill
>the process as soon as possible, without any stack walkback.
>
>> "Unrecoverable error": throw up a dialog for the developer and
>> exit (or crash to keep the call stack in view in the
>> debugger).
>
>Exactly. And that's not what exceptions do.
>
>> Exceptions, are more appropriately used where there is a
>> likelihood of recovering from the error condition rather than
>> being just for "unrecoverable errors".
>
>Again, it depends on what you mean by "recovering". If you just
>have to try again (e.g. user input error), then a simple while
>loop is a lot simpler than an exception.
:--}
I like THAT one. Nice style!
> Exceptions are useful
>when you can't really do anything about the error locally.
Not necessarily.
Again the string to number conversion exceptions.
Can be handled as locally as it gets.
And plenty of other things.
I don't think there is such a rule for it.
>Which often means that "recovery" is more or less impossible,
>since once you've left "locally", you've lost all of the
>necessary context to retry.
Not really.
You did loose the context withing the same stack frame.
Not a big deal.
Just make sure you handle that exception and clean up
some memory, even in Java you don't even have to worrry
even about doing that much.
Some local operation could be easily retried by the higher
levels in vast majority of situations, unless you read some
obviously wrong configuration parameter and it is not
going to work no matter how many times you retry it.
In that case, you throw on a higher level, after displaying
or logging the lower level, more precise and more detailed
result.
After that, you catch it on higher levels, and those levels
know much better what the whole operation is all about.
If they decide that, sorry, this can not be done even on
this level, they can rethrow even rougher generality
expception to the highest level loop.
At that point, your highest level logic knows what to do.
Either to wait for some time and try to retry, say in cases
where you lost a connection, which should be restored by
the O/S in a relatively short time.
Or, to simply abandon one of your major operations
and go on with the next item on the job list, if you have
anything like this, and THAT is where things become most
tricky.
>But maybe you mean something different by "recovering"?
>
>> Futher discussion of the application of exceptions is
>> appreciated. Keep in mind that while there are SOME general
>> vague "principles" of the application of exceptions, mostly
>> the scenarios need to be defined for fruitful discussion.
>> Please keep the examples simple but realistic and note the
>> assumptions you make.
>
>Concrete example:
>
> //! \pre
> //! No current output set up...
> void
> SomeClass::setupOutput()
> {
> assert(! myOutput.is_open());
Jesus!
> std::string filename = getFilename(); // Dialog with user...
> myOutput.open(filename.c_str());
> while (! myOutput.is_open()) {
> reportErrorToUser();
> filename = getFilename();
> myOutput.open(filename.c_str());
> }
> }
>
>Use of exceptions here would only make the code more
>complicated. (Try writing it in Java sometime:-). Where
>failure to open a file is reported via an exception.)
>
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== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 3:26 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <4183c779-1e37-40b8-9698-3375a33cb08e@26g2000yqo.googlegroups.com>, James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Dec 22, 4:06 pm, Vladimir Jovic <vladasp...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Stefan Ram wrote:
>
>> [snip]
>> > More elegantly? Actually, for correct and secure C++ code,
>> > all functions need to be written to be exception safe ,
>> > but only a minority of C++ programmers does so or even is
>> > aware of it.
>
>> Why?
>
>Because your program doesn't work right otherwise.
>
>Exceptions introduce an additional flow path into your code.
>Fundamentally, all "exception safety" really means is ensuring
>that the code is correct when this flow path is executed.
>Practically, it's a bit more complicated than that, because the
>number of additional flow paths soon makes the older,
>traditional ways of reasonning about program correction
>unmanageable; when C++ programmers speak of exception safety,
>they are generally referring to the more recently developed
>techniques to make this problem tractable. Effective use of
>destructors, for example---I'm not sure you can write correct
>code with exceptions unless the language has deterministic
>destructors.
That is why I like to read your stuff.
You always seem to invent something kinky.
These are one of those rare times when I have to stop reading
all this jazz and start looking at it.
What a pleasure!
:--}
Most of other stuff I just scroll by.
>> [snip]
>> >> Futher discussion of the application of exceptions is
>> >> appreciated.
>
>> > I prefer error results to exceptions. So all I would write
>> > about exceptions would start with If I was forced to use a
>> > language that would force me to use exceptions ...
>
>> > The applications of error results is as follows:
>
>> This should have probably been "switch" instead of "if" :
>
>> > if( attempt( to_do_something ))
>> > { case 0: /* ok, continue */ ... break;
>> > case 1: /* oops, handle */ ... break;
>> > ... }
>
>> Back to return value vs exceptions.
>
>> 1)
>> What happens if you can not handle the error in this method?
>
>Then you might prefer an exception.
>
>> Or in the method that called this method?
>> Or in the method that called the method that called the method where the
>> error happened?
>> etc
>
>The further up the stack you go, the more exceptions are called
>for. It's important to realize, however, that the alternative
>flow paths are still there, and that your code has to be correct
>if they're taken.
Deep.
>> 2) How do you handle errors in constructors?
>
>Or overloaded operators, or any other function which can't
>return a value, or has its return type imposed.
>
>The case of constructors is particular, however, in that an
>exception coming from a constructor means that you don't have an
>instance of the object at all. Which means that you don't have
>to worry about an invalid instance floating around. This often
>justifies exceptions even in cases where you wouldn't normally
>use them.
Cool argument.
>> 3) Simple example : how would you create a method (or a
>> function) that reads a value (some random integer) from a file
>> and returns that value?
>
> Fallible<int> readInt( std::istream& input );
>
>Although in this case, it's even simpler, because istream
>maintains an error state, which should be set if you can't read
>the value.
>
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== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 3:51 pm
From: tanix@mongo.net (tanix)
In article <4d3ba575-becf-4c40-be44-7e4d12fff3a8@p8g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>, James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Dec 22, 9:34 pm, ta...@mongo.net (tanix) wrote:
>> In article
>> <exceptions-20091222164...@ram.dialup.fu-berlin.de>,
>> r...@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram) wrote:
>
> [...]
>> > More elegantly? Actually, for correct and secure C++ code,
>> > all functions need to be written to be =BBexception safe=AB,
>
>> Correct.
>> Almost everything you do will generate some kind of exception,
>> at least in modern languages, and it is good it does.
>
>In order to write exception safe code, at least with value
>semantics (and I suspect even without value semantics, but I've
>not analysed the question in detail), it's been proven that you
>need a certain number of primitives which are guaranteed not to
>throw---one of the most classical C++ idioms, for example, only
>works if you have a version of swap that doesn't throw.
Cool. I like that. You ARE pretty inventive I'd say.
:--}
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: How do I write what the friend template function in template class?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/422bace48aaa5de5?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 4:17 pm
From: maigre_dragon
I write a template class.
example:
template < typename T >
class MemoryMap{
public:
MemoryMap(const T):data_(T){}
friend:
std::ostream& operator<< (std::ostream& out,MemoryMap<T>& x){
size_t length=sizeof(x.data_);
Byte* p=reinterpret_cast<Byte*>(&x.data_);
for (size_t i=0;i<length;i++)
{
assert( i<length );
out<<*p++<<' ';
}
return out;
}
private:
T data_;
};
question:
I need special a special fucntion that " std::ostream& operator<<
(std::ostream out, MemoryMap<char*>& x) ".
Is special template class or special template function?
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Dec 23 2009 12:21 am
From: Vladimir Jovic
maigre_dragon wrote:
> I write a template class.
> example:
> template < typename T >
> class MemoryMap{
> public:
> MemoryMap(const T):data_(T){}
> friend:
> std::ostream& operator<< (std::ostream& out,MemoryMap<T>& x){
> size_t length=sizeof(x.data_);
> Byte* p=reinterpret_cast<Byte*>(&x.data_);
> for (size_t i=0;i<length;i++)
> {
> assert( i<length );
> out<<*p++<<' ';
> }
> return out;
> }
> private:
> T data_;
> };
> question:
> I need special a special fucntion that " std::ostream& operator<<
> (std::ostream out, MemoryMap<char*>& x) ".
> Is special template class or special template function?
>
wow have you tried to compile your example? Or you just took from some
dodgy web site?
Here is corrected class:
template < typename T >
class MemoryMap{
public:
MemoryMap(const T dp):data_(dp){}
friend std::ostream& operator<< (std::ostream& out,MemoryMap<T>& x)
{
size_t length=sizeof(x.data_);
unsigned char* p=reinterpret_cast< unsigned char* >(&x.data_);
for (size_t i=0;i<length;i++)
{
assert( i<length );
out<<*p++<<' ';
}
return out;
}
private:
T data_;
};
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Math/CompSci Interview Question - Thoughts?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/a1cffd71c99a2dd0?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 6:48 pm
From: "Ostap S. B. M. Bender Jr."
On Nov 21, 8:12 am, Andrew Tomazos <and...@tomazos.com> wrote:
> I was posed the following question in a technical interview for a
> Software Engineering position by a major multinational NASDAQ company:
>
> [Paraphrasing] "You are given an array of 1,000,000 32-bit integers.
> One int value x occurs 500,001 times or more in the array. Specify an
> algorithm to determine x."
>
> The assumption being extra points for efficiency.
>
> I initially came up with a linear space, linear time solution. With
> some prompting and hints from the interviewer we worked our way to a
> smaller constant space and linear time algorithm. That being
> basically:
>
> int findmode(int* p, int n)
> {
> int count[32];
> for(int i = 0; i < 32; i++)
> count[i] = 0;
>
> for (int i = 0; i < n; i++)
> for (int j = 0; j < 32; j++)
> if (p[i] & (1 << j)) // if bit j is on
> count[j]++;
> else
> count[j]--;
>
> int x = 0;
> for (int i = 0; i < 32; i++)
> if (count[i] > 0)
> x = x | (1 << i);
>
> return x;
>
> }
>
> The idea here is to count the frequency of each of the 32 bits in the
> array separately, knowing that these bit counts will be dominated by
> the mode.
>
> The interviewer already knew the answer, so I can only assume the test
> was based on how much help he had to give me to arrive at it.
>
> My question about this is as follows. I, perhaps boldly, claim to
> employers to have a "masters-equivilant" experience/knowledge of
> computer science and math. Should I have been able to come up with
> this solution without prompting or help?
>
> Would you expect someone with a CompSci Masters or PhD from some major
> ivy league university to be able to come up with this solution without
> help?
>
> If so in what course or from which book would you expect to learn the
> required knowledge to come up with the above solution?
>
> Is the skill to be able to come up with such an algorithm something
> that is learned by studying lots of algorithms and being able to mix
> and match the "tricks"? If so, what is a similar commonly known
> algorithm(s) on which the above solution could have been based?
>
> Or, is the ability to invent such a solution simply a matter of IQ?
> Some people have the talent to solve the puzzle, see the pattern and
> come up with the solution - and some just don't?
>
How badly would the following simple algorithm work:
Look at the first column. Determine which digit occurs more - 0 or 1 -
among the 1,000,000 integers, and mark those integers, that don't have
this digit, as "R" (for "rejects")
Then go to the second column. Determine which digit occurs more - 0 or
1 - among the integers not marked "R", and mark those integers, that
don't have this digit, as "R".
.
.
.
Then go to the i'th column. Determine which digit occurs more - 0 or 1
- among the integers not marked "R", and mark those integers, that
don't have this digit, as "R".
At the end, return any integer not marked by "R".
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Choose to use compile time or dynamic run time for big array.
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/71068d5147ffd25a?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Dec 22 2009 7:31 pm
From: Immortal Nephi
The programmers want to create a big array. The array can have 1
million elements. They need to decide how to store big array in
either source code or binary file.
They choose compile time. They fill data in each element of big
array on the source code.
They choose dynamic run time. They load binary file through fstream.
Please let me know. Are both examples acceptable to the programmer's
preference? If you are against compile time or dynamic run time,
please explain your opinion.
For example:
// Compile Time
class ArrayName
{
public:
ArrayName() {}
~ArrayName() {}
private:
static const unsigned char s_kData[ 1000000 ];
};
const unsigned char ArrayName::s_kData[ 1000000 ] =
{
0x12, 0x15, 0x45, // …..more data go into elements
};
You can create multiple ArrayName objects. All ArrayName objects
share s_kData.
// Dynamic Run Time
class ArrayName
{
public:
ArrayName()
{
if( s_pData == 0 )
{
s_pData = new unsigned char[ 1000000 ];
// Do something
// Use fstream to open and read data from binary file
// Copy and store data into s_pData memory
// Close binary file
}
}
~ArrayName()
{
if( s_pData != 0 )
{
delete [] s_pData;
s_pData = 0;
}
}
private:
static unsigned char* s_pData;
};
unsigned char* ArrayName::s_pData = 0;
If you create more than one ArrayName objects, first object allocates
memory before second object or more objects do not need to reallocate
and share s_pData.
After you are ready to destruct all ArrayName objects, last object
tests to see if pointer is not zero before it deallocates memory and
add zero to s_pData. First object and other objects are prevented to
deallocate s_pData.
Please share with me your opinion.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Dec 23 2009 12:16 am
From: Vladimir Jovic
Immortal Nephi wrote:
> The programmers want to create a big array. The array can have 1
> million elements. They need to decide how to store big array in
> either source code or binary file.
> They choose compile time. They fill data in each element of big
> array on the source code.
> They choose dynamic run time. They load binary file through fstream.
> Please let me know. Are both examples acceptable to the programmer's
> preference? If you are against compile time or dynamic run time,
> please explain your opinion.
>
[snip]
For linux (I don't know for other OSes) you can mmap() a file, and have
that data in virtual memory. Not sure if that is what your question is
about.
If not, then I would prefer loading a binary file at the start of the
program.
==============================================================================
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