| rep_movsd <rep.movsd@gmail.com>: Dec 09 07:57AM -0800 On Tuesday, December 3, 2019 at 1:29:31 AM UTC+5:30, Lynn McGuire wrote: > https://www.infoq.com/news/2019/11/microsoft-exploring-rust-safety/ > I doubt it. > Lynn MS did it before - remember the Singularity OS, Sing# and Spec# ? MS keeps trying many things, but there is still Windows 3.1 code in Windows 10 and it wont ever go away. Closer to home even the VC6 MSVCRT.DLL is still around in Windows AFAIK |
| Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz>: Dec 09 11:03AM -0600 rep_movsd wrote: ----snip---- > MS did it before - remember the Singularity OS, Sing# and Spec# ? > MS keeps trying many things, but there is still Windows 3.1 code in > Windows 10 I very much doubt that. Windows 3.1 is a M$ kludge. Windows 10 is descended from Windows NT, which was written by DEC. ----snip---- |
| scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal): Dec 09 05:08PM >> Windows 10 >I very much doubt that. Windows 3.1 is a M$ kludge. Windows 10 is >descended from Windows NT, which was written by DEC. Windows NT was written by Microsoft, led by former DEC engineer (Dave Cutler). While there are some structural similarities between VMS and NT sourcebases (I've worked with both), NT was certainly _not_ written by DEC. NT3.51 and NT4.0 (Win2k) both contained portions of Windows 3.1 in the so-called 'Windows on Windows' subsystem. |
| Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz>: Dec 09 11:39AM -0600 Scott Lurndal wrote: > > descended from Windows NT, which was written by DEC. > Windows NT was written by Microsoft, led by former DEC engineer > (Dave Cutler). It was written by a team hired from DEC led by Dave Cutler. Some members of the M$ OS 2 team joined them. Note that DEC had control and use of NT until well after delivery. Though it was written *for* M$, it took coding far beyond the quality and capabilities that are the usual M$ fare. To call it a M$ product is contractually correct, but wrong in every other sense, AFAIC. > While there are some structural similarities between > VMS and NT sourcebases (I've worked with both), NT was certainly > _not_ written by DEC. True. Mea culpa for the overstatement. > NT3.51 and NT4.0 (Win2k) both contained portions of Windows 3.1 in the > so-called 'Windows on Windows' subsystem. IOW, a partial emulator? The best incarnation of NT was on the "screamer", the DEC Alpha. IMO. |
| scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal): Dec 09 06:26PM >> NT3.51 and NT4.0 (Win2k) both contained portions of Windows 3.1 in the >> so-called 'Windows on Windows' subsystem. >IOW, a partial emulator? WoW used the intel vm86 mode to execute pure win3.1 code. |
| Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz>: Dec 09 03:50PM -0600 Scott Lurndal wrote: > > > so-called 'Windows on Windows' subsystem. > > IOW, a partial emulator? > WoW used the intel vm86 mode to execute pure win3.1 code. Amazing. I cannot fathom why anyone would want backwards compatibility with such a dud. Both Apple and RISC OS were streets ahead. Although, come to think of it, a 1980s employer of mine had a large database operation upgrade done, and the data entry machines specified in the contract were Win 3.1 thin clients. Euw! |
| Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com>: Dec 09 10:16PM > MS did it before - remember the Singularity OS, Sing# and Spec# ? > MS keeps trying many things, but there is still Windows 3.1 code in Windows 10 and it wont ever go away. > Closer to home even the VC6 MSVCRT.DLL is still around in Windows AFAIK This is because they don't wont to ditch old habits. Lame. -- press any key to continue or any other to quit... U ničemu ja ne uživam kao u svom statusu INVALIDA -- Zli Zec Svi smo svedoci - oko 3 godine intenzivne propagande je dovoljno da jedan narod poludi -- Zli Zec Na divljem zapadu i nije bilo tako puno nasilja, upravo zato jer su svi bili naoruzani. -- Mladen Gogala |
| Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com>: Dec 09 10:16PM >> Windows 10 > I very much doubt that. Windows 3.1 is a M$ kludge. Windows 10 is > descended from Windows NT, which was written by DEC. kernel only. -- press any key to continue or any other to quit... U ničemu ja ne uživam kao u svom statusu INVALIDA -- Zli Zec Svi smo svedoci - oko 3 godine intenzivne propagande je dovoljno da jedan narod poludi -- Zli Zec Na divljem zapadu i nije bilo tako puno nasilja, upravo zato jer su svi bili naoruzani. -- Mladen Gogala |
| Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz>: Dec 09 04:25PM -0600 Melzzzzz wrote: > > I very much doubt that. Windows 3.1 is a M$ kludge. Windows 10 is > > descended from Windows NT, which was written by DEC. > kernel only. Actually a DEC team who had worked on VMS and were hired for the job. I read in BYTE (Aug. 1985, IIRC) that after taking delivery, M$ set about "improving" it. The example given by BYTE was the removal of code that tested the graphics card before every write. For the speedup. |
| Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com>: Dec 09 04:33PM -0600 On 12/9/2019 9:57 AM, rep_movsd wrote: > MS did it before - remember the Singularity OS, Sing# and Spec# ? > MS keeps trying many things, but there is still Windows 3.1 code in Windows 10 and it wont ever go away. > Closer to home even the VC6 MSVCRT.DLL is still around in Windows AFAIK You can read about the process to create Windows NT here, "Show Stopper!: The Breakneck Race to Create Windows NT and the Next Generation at Microsoft" https://www.amazon.com/Show-Stopper-Breakneck-Generation-Microsoft/dp/0029356717/ Highly recommended. Lynn |
| Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com>: Dec 09 04:35PM -0600 On 12/9/2019 4:25 PM, Ned Latham wrote: > I read in BYTE (Aug. 1985, IIRC) that after taking delivery, M$ set > about "improving" it. The example given by BYTE was the removal of > code that tested the graphics card before every write. For the speedup. The true speedup was moving the graphics device into ring 0. And the cause of many crashes due to buggy video device drivers. Lynn |
| Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz>: Dec 09 05:19PM -0600 Lynn McGuire wrote: > > code that tested the graphics card before every write. For the speedup. > The true speedup was moving the graphics device into ring 0. And the > cause of many crashes due to buggy video device drivers. Way to go, M$! |
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