soft and program: comp.lang.c++ - 25 new messages in 16 topics

comp.lang.c++
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++?hl=en

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Today's topics:

* Auditing A Business Risk Approach (6thEd) - Rittenberg – Solutions Manual
and Test is available for purchase! Contact me at instructors.team[at]gmail.
com - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/c404ba636e923693?hl=en
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* Blog: C++ Code Smells - 6 messages, 4 authors
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* static inline functions - possible? - 2 messages, 1 author
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* negative powers of two - 1 messages, 1 author
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Auditing A Business Risk Approach (6thEd) - Rittenberg – Solutions
Manual and Test is available for purchase! Contact me at instructors.team[at]
gmail.com
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/c404ba636e923693?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 6:00 am
From: "Pearson & prentice hall solutions"

Auditing A Business Risk Approach (6thEd) - Rittenberg – Solutions
Manual and Test is available for purchase! Contact me at
instructors.team[at]gmail.com

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TOPIC: Blog: C++ Code Smells
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/1aab587446556099?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 6:39 am
From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard)

[Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]

Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> spake the secret code
<aoVcm.42$k86.41@read4.inet.fi> thusly:

>Richard wrote:
>> <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/2009/07/30/c-code-smells/>
>
> Those are rather usual "you should avoid these" points when
>programming in C++. Nothing new, really.

Didn't claim I invented or found something new.

Lots of people still don't know this stuff, however.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download
<http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/the-direct3d-graphics-pipeline/>

Legalize Adulthood! <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com>

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 6:42 am
From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard)

[Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]

pasa <pasa@lib.hu> spake the secret code
<ae0c1a94-6737-4c38-8558-62578fd8917f@c1g2000yqi.googlegroups.com> thusly:

>On Aug 1, 10:50 am, legalize+jee...@mail.xmission.com (Richard) wrote:
>> <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/2009/07/30/c-code-smells/>
>>
>> A recent security bulletin from Microsoft highlights the dangers of
>> certain constructs in C++. These constructs constitute a set of code
>> smells for C++. In this post, I'll describe what I consider to be C++
>> code smells and how to deal with them.
>
>Why not read some books like Effective C++, C++ Gotchas, C++ Coding
>Standard, etc instead? Those certainly list your discoveries in the
>first couple items, and have a hundred more

I didn't claim to have "discovered" them.

Despite such books being available, lots of people still don't know
this stuff.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download
<http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/the-direct3d-graphics-pipeline/>

Legalize Adulthood! <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com>

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 6:44 am
From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard)

[Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]

Jonathan Lee <chorus@shaw.ca> spake the secret code
<9558b386-0e05-42f3-b979-7eb5a67d00d5@o6g2000yqj.googlegroups.com> thusly:

>On Aug 1, 4:50 am, legalize+jee...@mail.xmission.com (Richard) wrote:
>> [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]
>>
>> <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/2009/07/30/c-code-smells/>
>>
>> A recent security bulletin from Microsoft highlights the dangers of
>> certain constructs in C++.
>
>Well written, but hardly exhaustive. See:
>
>https://www.securecoding.cert.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=637

I didn't claim to have written an exhaustive list.

I find it odd that a site containing security information is forcing
me to use https for just browsing information. Why does it need to be
secured?

I did find that an interesting document to browse and I'm guessing
that what I covered in my blog post is buried in there somewhere, its
not exactly accessible reading to a new C++ programmer.
--
"The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download
<http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/the-direct3d-graphics-pipeline/>

Legalize Adulthood! <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com>

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 7:00 am
From: Jonathan Lee

On Aug 2, 9:44 am, legalize+jee...@mail.xmission.com (Richard) wrote:
> Jonathan Lee <cho...@shaw.ca> spake the secret code
> >Well written, but hardly exhaustive. See:
> I didn't claim to have written an exhaustive list.

Sorry, it wasn't meant as a criticism. Only as a contribution to the
subject.

> I find it odd that a site containing security information is forcing
> me to use https for just browsing information. Why does it need to be
> secured?

Probably no "real" reason. They just seem to be obsessed with
security.

> its not exactly accessible reading to a new C++ programmer.

Yeah. They're targeting people who are already comfortable with the
language.

--Jonathan

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 8:47 am
From: "Alf P. Steinbach"

* Richard:
> [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]
>
> <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com/2009/07/30/c-code-smells/>

As others have remarked, observations about generally not using void* and so on
are not exactly new.

But it doesn't hurt repeating.

I think the section on 'void*' presents a too simplistic view to be completely
accurate, but perhaps that slight over-simplification is exactly what's needed
for all those peppering their code with 'void*'. Situations where some
reinterpret_cast to typeless pointer cannot be avoided include calling an
existing C API function with arg type 'void**'. Discussing this and other issues
would however increase the size and complexity of the text several-fold.

> A recent security bulletin from Microsoft highlights the dangers of
> certain constructs in C++. These constructs constitute a set of code
> smells for C++. In this post, I'll describe what I consider to be C++
> code smells and how to deal with them.

Perhaps you meant to present the above paragraph and the link in the opposite
sequence, and perhaps you're the author of the linked to web page.

But if you'd already authored the web page then what does the "I will" mean, why
then the reference to "this post", and why does it come after the link?

Cheers,

- Alf

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:26 am
From: Gerhard Fiedler

Richard wrote:

> I find it odd that a site containing security information is forcing
> me to use https for just browsing information. Why does it need to be
> secured?

What difference do you see between being forced to use http and being
forced to use https?

Gerhard

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==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 8:14 am
From: Nick Keighley

On 1 Aug, 18:33, Juha Nieminen <nos...@thanks.invalid> wrote:
> Nick Keighley wrote:
> > well, you've got to write your destructors correctly.
>
> I think you are just trying to rationalize how RAII doesn't *really*
> bring any benefit compared to manual scope management,

nope. I consider RAII to be one C++s good points. I'm simply saying
people (or people from a C background) don't just stumble upon
RAII on their own (well most people). RAII is a coding convention.

> as if it was
> completely equivalent to have to perhaps write a destructor once and
> have the compiler call it automatically from every place where the
> object is used, and to have to basically inline destructors manually at
> each usage point.
>
> Besides, you are missing the point: "Writing destructors correctly" is
> not a coding convention to *get around a limitation* in the language.
> It's using a language feature for its intended purpose and to help
> reduce the amount of coding conventions needed in the program.

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TOPIC: question on vector<char>::difference_type
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/0887bb3c0dd6545e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 8:48 am
From: "subramanian100in@yahoo.com, India"

On Jul 31, 4:26 am, James Kanze <james.ka...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 2:26 am, Victor Bazarov <v.Abaza...@comAcast.net> wrote:
>
> > subramanian10...@yahoo.com, India wrote:
> > > I wrote the following program for learning purpose only.
> > > [..]
> > > Why is the difference_type not large enough to hold the
> > > distance between any two iterators ?
> > That's a good question you should most likely be asking the
> > implementors of the standard library you're using. The
> > quantities and the types are implementation-defined. Some
> > implementors *could* decide to use a larger signed type for
> > 'difference_type' just to satisfy that requirement.
> > Apparently in the particular implementation you use, they
> > didn't. Why?... How should we know?
>
> Does the implementation actually have a choice? I can't find
> any concrete requirement in the C standard saying that ptrdiff_t
> must have the same size as size_t, but this would seem to be the
> intent. Particularly as the standard says that subtraction of
> two pointers is undefined behavior if the result is not
> representable in a ptrdiff_t---the standard explicitly caters to
> the case in question.
>
> Of course, the code in question dealt with std::vector and a
> difference between two iterators. In this case, the C++
> standard is somewhat less explicit, but it does say that a
> precondition to the expression is "there exists a value n of
> Distance such that a + b == b[...]"; in the case in question,
> the pre-condition is not met, so the behavior is undefined.
>
> Logically, of course, the error is using two types, size_t and
> ptrdiff_t, rather than just ptrdiff_t. Still, an implementation
> could detect the error (although I suspect that most consider it
> too rare to be worth the bother), or simply refuse to allocate a
> container so large that the error could occur, making max_size()
> equal to:
> min( numeric_limits< ptrdiff_t >::max(),
> numeric_limits< size_t >::max() / sizeof( T ) )
>
> --
> James Kanze (GABI Software) email:james.ka...@gmail.com
> Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
> Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
> 9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, +33 (0)1 30 23 00 34

The following question is related to the program description given at
the beginning of the original post in this thread.

Given C++ Standard Library implementations like g++ 3.4.3(Under RedHat
Linux) wherein the the maximum value that can be stored in
vector<char>::difference_type is smaller than the maximum value that
can be stored in vector<char>::size_type, what should I do to
calculate the difference between two iterators in such a way that the
correct distance between the iterators is returned - that is, how do I
calculate the difference between two iterators when the difference
overflows or underflows the maximum or minimum values of
vector<char>::difference_type (as it overflows in the example program
I have given) ?

Is it possible to know whether such a difference between iterators
would overflow or underflow ?

Is it possible to write code which uses implementation-defined types
like vector<T>::difference_type and at the same time portable across
different implementations of the C++ Standard library ?

Kindly explain.

Thanks
V.Subramanian

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:54 am
From: Juha Nieminen

subramanian100in@yahoo.com, India wrote:
> Given C++ Standard Library implementations like g++ 3.4.3(Under RedHat
> Linux) wherein the the maximum value that can be stored in
> vector<char>::difference_type is smaller than the maximum value that
> can be stored in vector<char>::size_type, what should I do to
> calculate the difference between two iterators in such a way that the
> correct distance between the iterators is returned - that is, how do I
> calculate the difference between two iterators when the difference
> overflows or underflows the maximum or minimum values of
> vector<char>::difference_type (as it overflows in the example program
> I have given) ?

The difference type is signed because when you do a "iter2 - iter1",
it accounts for the possibility that iter1 is larger (or, more
precisely, points to a value which is at a higher position in the
vector) than iter2, in which case the [iter1,iter2] range is actually
reversed.

If you know for sure that iter2 will always be >= iter1, then an
unsigned difference type could be used for their difference, in which
case you get the whole range of the maximum capacity of the vector.

If your target system uses integers using two's complement
representation (as basically all computers in this universe do), you can
simply cast the result of the difference to an unsigned type (size_t)
and you'll get the correct result even if the temporary value (before
the cast) had overflowed.

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: static inline functions - possible?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/0386357e12bd0064?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:39 am
From: Juha Nieminen

Stephen Horne wrote:
> An occasional multi-liner isn't a disaster, but if it really needs
> multiple lines, it probably shouldn't be inline anyway.

There may be many reasons why a function cannot be written completely
on one single line, other than the function consisting of a lot of code.

For example, your variable names may be descriptive and long, in which
case you easily hit your favorite maximum line length (personally I use
80 characters, I hear other people use eg. 100 characters) even if the
function is nothing more than a 'return' and some simple arithmetic
involving a couple of variables. (Heck, even if your function does
nothing more than return the value of a variable and nothing else, the
entire function definition and implementation may be too long because of
the names being used, plus indentation.)

Also it's not unusual for an inline function to, for example, do one
of two possible things (using a conditional), which is most naturally
written as at least two lines of code. Even if the code was so short
that you could fit it all into one single line, writing an entire
if/else statement into one line is more obfuscatory than anything else.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:44 am
From: Juha Nieminen

James Kanze wrote:
> At least in the places I've worked, putting the definition
> inside the class has been forbidden. (There are several reasons
> for this, and they don't apply everywhere, but on the whole, I'd
> go along with the rule, at least for definitions in exported
> header files.)

Sometimes it just feels tempting to implement a function which is
really, really short, right there in the declaration, as it saves
writing effort. A typical example goes like:

class MyClass
{
int value;

public:
MyClass(int someValue): value(someValue) {}
...
};

==============================================================================
TOPIC: negative powers of two
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/50db9695edc9e79f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:50 am
From: Keith H Duggar

On Aug 2, 5:59 am, James Kanze <james.ka...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 1, 4:38 pm, Jerry Coffin <jerryvcof...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > In article <069cb282-77ec-45c0-bcd6-2aa88e53ec48
> > @k6g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, james.ka...@gmail.com says...
> > > On Jul 31, 6:01 pm, Jerry Coffin <jerryvcof...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > [ ... ]
> > > > Whether this will be faster than pow() will depend -- for
> > > > a lot of cases where the floating point is stored as a
> > > > significand and a power of two, frexp will be something
> > > > like a mask, shift and an integer subtraction to remove a
> > > > bias in the exponent. As you'd expect, ldexp will pretty
> > > > much reverse that: add the bias, shift to the right
> > > > position, OR with the significand. Generally pretty fast.
> > > > OTOH, if the native floating point representation is
> > > > drastically different from that, they could end up pretty
> > > > slow -- but machines with such strange floating point
> > > > representations are pretty unusual.
> > > Not really. I don't know of any mainframe which uses base 2
> > > for its floating point: IBM uses base 16, and both Unisys
> > > architectures use base 8; Unisys MCP also normalizes in a
> > > somewhat strange way. The fact that the bases are powers of
> > > two means that the operation can still be done with masking
> > > and shifting, but it requires a bit more than a base 2
> > > representation would.
> > You start by saying "not really", but from what I can see, you
> > then go on to pretty much confirm what I said -- that while
> > these machines aren't binary, they still work in a power of
> > two, which means that frexp/ldexp will probably be faster than
> > pow() for all of them.
>
> The algorithm you described only applies to machines with base 2
> floating point, not base 8 or 16. And IBM mainframes aren't
> "pretty unusual", they're the most common mainframe around. (I
> think that Unisys is second in the market, and the Unisys MCP
> does have a somewhat exotic representation, normalizing with the
> decimal to the right, and not to the left, and not requiring
> normalization at all---the idea is that an integer and a
> floating point have the same bitwise representation.)

Don't forget about Jerry's "trump card": the word "drastically".
If some variation of his shifting method is slow then the float
representation is "drastically" different and he is right. If some
variation of his shifting method is fast then the representation
is not "drastically" different and he is *still* right.

Furthermore, even if he determines that base-16 is "drastically"
different, since IBM mainframes support both base-16 and base-2
(even if it is optional) he is *still* right because it either
works with his method (base-2) or the users are running the IBM
mainframe in a "drastically" different configuration (even if
it is the default and preferred configuration).

Finally, similar "trump reasoning" will apply to Unisys perhaps
with some market share speculations or buzzwords like "modern"
thrown into the mix as well.

In other words, there is no defense against Jerry's ignorant
speculations. No matter what hard evidence and solid reasoning
you supply he will always be right. And even if by miracle you
convince him, we will probably never know because he likely
will not admit he was wrong here publicly (preferring to
slither quietly away instead).

KHD

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Sunday, August 2, 2009

comp.lang.c++ - 25 new messages in 16 topics - digest

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