soft and program: comp.lang.c++ - 26 new messages in 20 topics

comp.lang.c++
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++?hl=en

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Today's topics:

* Why are Set & Get important? - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/50147ff11c51f246?hl=en
* Deleting the last element of an std::set - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/bbdfc34cc3c5947e?hl=en
* initialize from another function - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/62041f4a48c096be?hl=en
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messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/a9b2c7b3a4f4c043?hl=en
* C++ Primer 4th edition Reference Counting Smart Pointers - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/37c1becf77aa6c3d?hl=en
* Is std::wcout really required? - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/e41ac896e5f966a5?hl=en
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http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/61538dedfa585366?hl=en
* using typename - 2 messages, 2 authors
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* Proposal: More flexible comparisons - 1 messages, 1 author
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http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/d12138169e67645f?hl=en
* Deleting a pointer - 1 messages, 1 author
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Why are Set & Get important?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/50147ff11c51f246?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 12:19 am
From: Jorgen Grahn

On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:10:03 +0200, Bart van Ingen Schenau <bart@ingen.ddns.info> wrote:
> Immortal Nephi wrote:
>
>> The base class has some data members. Tens of member functions or
>> hundreds of member functions modify data members.

...

>> What if programmer
>> make mistakes? They might assign incorrect value to the data
>> members. Then, they have to examine all tens of member functions or
>> hundreds of member functions to try and locate incorrect values.
>
> If the programmer makes a mistake, then the unit-test of the function
> containing the mistake should fail, giving a very direct indication
> where to look for the problem.

Trying to "lock down" the code is IMHO a good thing in general. You
wouldn't recommend unit tests instead of static type checking, right?

I agree about setters and getters, but I think it's dangerous to wave
the unit test card too often. Before we know it, we may all be
programming in Python ;-)

/Jorgen

--
// Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu
\X/ snipabacken.se> R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 12:53 am
From: Jorgen Grahn

On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), James Kanze <james.kanze@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 28, 11:10 am, Ian Collins <ian-n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Juha Nieminen wrote:
>> > Immortal Nephi wrote:
>> >> Tens of member functions or hundreds of member functions
>> >> modify data members.
>
>> > I'd say that if you have tens or even hundreds of accessor
>> > functions, your class design is flawed.
>
>> Or even a couple!
>
> It depends. The role of some classes is to represent specific
> data. In such classes, almost all member functions would be
> getters and setters (under some name or another).

At that point I often break down and call it a struct with public data
members (but with well-defined construction and copy semantics).

One thing which helps a lot is if these data members are real,
distinct types. If I encounter a

struct Foo { int a, b, c; };

my first reaction is *not* to add set/get methods. Instead I look
at a, b and c and try to find out if they can't be made something
more type-safe than just an int. Maybe a and b together really
form a distinct type, and so on.

I think tiny, concrete types are underused in much C++ code.
Maybe too many programmers come from Java, where there is a
performance penalty for anything more complex than an int.

/Jorgen

--
// Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu
\X/ snipabacken.se> R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 1:44 am
From: James Kanze

On Jun 29, 9:53 am, Jorgen Grahn <grahn+n...@snipabacken.se> wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), James Kanze <james.ka...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jun 28, 11:10 am, Ian Collins <ian-n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Juha Nieminen wrote:
> >> > Immortal Nephi wrote:
> >> >> Tens of member functions or hundreds of member functions
> >> >> modify data members.

> >> > I'd say that if you have tens or even hundreds of accessor
> >> > functions, your class design is flawed.

> >> Or even a couple!

> > It depends. The role of some classes is to represent
> > specific data. In such classes, almost all member functions
> > would be getters and setters (under some name or another).

> At that point I often break down and call it a struct with
> public data members (but with well-defined construction and
> copy semantics).

I tend to call it a structure as well. But as far as C++ is
concerned, it is a class, even if I declare it with the keyword
'struct'.

> One thing which helps a lot is if these data members are real,
> distinct types. If I encounter a

> struct Foo { int a, b, c; };

> my first reaction is *not* to add set/get methods. Instead I
> look at a, b and c and try to find out if they can't be made
> something more type-safe than just an int. Maybe a and b
> together really form a distinct type, and so on.

That's not a bad policy, in general. (It would be even better
if we has a variant of typedef which created a new type.) But
it's not always applicable, and in some cases, even if it could
be applicable, it would be overkill; you wouldn't really want
complex to be anything but two floating point types. And third
party interfaces have to be considered: the data base interface
will readily accept ints, but will probably bawk at your own
special type.

> I think tiny, concrete types are underused in much C++ code.
> Maybe too many programmers come from Java, where there is a
> performance penalty for anything more complex than an int.

I agree with you there, but I won't go to the other extreme
either.

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:james.kanze@gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, +33 (0)1 30 23 00 34

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Deleting the last element of an std::set
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/bbdfc34cc3c5947e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 12:08 am
From: Bart van Ingen Schenau

Giuliano Bertoletti wrote:

> Bo Persson ha scritto:
>> Giuliano Bertoletti wrote:
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> another question: I wish to erase the last element of a set (last
>>> according to some custom less operator I have defined for that set).
>>>
>>> Is the following code correct ?
>>> What worries me most is the --hi.end() construct.
>>>
>>> std::set< sometype > hi;
>>>
>>> if(!hi.empty()) {
>>> hi.erase( --hi.end() );
>>> }
>>>
>>
>> The potential problem is that if the iterator is actually a raw
>> pointer (could be for std::vector, but hardly for a std::set), you
>> cannot decrement the temporary returned by end().
>> If the iterator is a
>> class with an operator--() member function, is will be ok.
>>
>
>
> I'm not following you.
>
> I'm not the designer of the container class but, why would a vector
> iterator, which is also a random iterator, not support the -- operator
> ?

It is not so much what operations the iterator type supports, but rather
what operations the language allows you to do on the return-value of a
function.

Container::end() returns an iterator by value (so as a temporary
object), and the only way you can modify such an object is by calling a
member-function on it.
If the iterator type has operator--() declared as a member, then the
expression '--hi.end()' is interpreted as 'hi.end().operaor--()', which
is a valid construct.
If operator--() is not a member function, then it can not be applied to
the result of Container::end(), so the expression '--hi.end()' must
result in a diagnostic.

If you want to get the before-last iterator without these considerations
with operator--, you can use this helper function:

template <typename It>
It prev(It iter)
{
return --iter;
}

/* use as: prev(hi.end()) */

>
> Cheers,
> Giulio.

Bart v Ingen Schenau
--
a.c.l.l.c-c++ FAQ: http://www.comeaucomputing.com/learn/faq
c.l.c FAQ: http://c-faq.com/
c.l.c++ FAQ: http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/

==============================================================================
TOPIC: initialize from another function
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/62041f4a48c096be?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 12:22 am
From: Bart van Ingen Schenau

Michael Sgier wrote:

> Hi
> Yes I should have shown the init as there's exectly where I get the
> errors. So texLogo = loadTexture("Images/carmine_64x16.png",1,0);
> and ftglCreatePixmapFont("Fonts/MgOpenModataOblique.ttf");
> don't load or create. Why? That's exactly my problem here.
>
> This shared lib gets loaded from X-Plane as a plugin. Now this was
> a openGL standalone app and works if I simply put the previous class
> into main. Now I want to call it from within a plugin function and get
> rid of window creation and related functions. But first simply get
> loadTexture and ftglCreatePixmapFont working. I've included the
> headers and it compiles.
> As I've only done some VB.NET so far I guess I've the declarations of
> loadTexture and ftglCreatePixmapFont at some wrong location? Those
> declarations are in another file...can I leave it that way?
> Yes this C++ linking is still weird to me...
> Many thanks
> Michael
>
<snip>
>
> * \brief Initialises the demonstration.
> * \return true, if initialization succeeds.
> * false, otherwise.
> */
> bool Demo::init()
> {
> if (!App::init(WIDTH, HEIGHT, BITDEPTH, false, "What is a demo for ?
> Showing Off !"))

My first guess would be that App::init returns false, with as result
that the functions in question are never called.
Possible reasons for App:init returning false are:
- The function may not be called by a plugin, but only by an application
- The function was already called once, and fails on every subsequent
invocation

> {
> return false;
> }
>
<snip - rest of init function>

Bart v Ingen Schenau
--
a.c.l.l.c-c++ FAQ: http://www.comeaucomputing.com/learn/faq
c.l.c FAQ: http://c-faq.com/
c.l.c++ FAQ: http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 2:46 am
From: Michael Sgier

No I've commented those lines now.

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==============================================================================

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: C++ Primer 4th edition Reference Counting Smart Pointers
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/37c1becf77aa6c3d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Sun, Jun 28 2009 10:42 am
From: Hendrik Schober

CplusplusNewbie wrote:
> In Scott Meyers' Effective STL, he stresses that it's incredibly
> difficult to write smart-pointer code, and that his attempts in one of
> his own texts had several bugs etc.
>
> This confuses me somewhat because Lippman, Lajoie and Moo's C++ Primer
> 4th ed contains extensive smart-pointer code and it doesn't appear
> terribly difficult.
>
> Are there hidden problems with the RCSP code in C++ Primer 4th ed that
> I'm missing?

I wouldn't know, as I haven't looked closely at the Primer's
implementation and I probably wouldn't find the bugs anyway,
as, IIRC, Scott's point was that they are quite subtle.
Some personal data: Out of two companies I have seen in the
last years where a home-grown 'shared_ptr'-lookalike was used,
two had subtle errors in it. Since one of them was derived
from an early version of boost's 'shared_ptr', I suppose that,
too, had subtle errors in it.

Here's two ways to find out more about this (please and report
back here): I know that Scott Meyers draws a lot of his wisdom
from newsgroup discussions and doesn't at all hesitate to ask
seemingly simple questions (for us to find out that the answer
is all but simple). So you could go and dig in google groups
about discussions he sparked (I'd look in comp.lang.c++moderated
and comp.standard.c++) on this.
Or you could go and sift through boost's archives for their
discussions on the topic. (Which might bring you to Scott's
postings, too, now that I think of it.)

> Many Thanks.

HTH,

Schobi

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Is std::wcout really required?
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/e41ac896e5f966a5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 1:37 am
From: James Kanze

On Jun 28, 10:58 pm, "Alf P. Steinbach" <al...@start.no> wrote:
> * James Kanze:
> > On Jun 27, 10:17 pm, "Alf P. Steinbach" <al...@start.no> wrote:
> >> * Amit Kumar:

> >>> Output of all the four statements are the same on Visual
> >>> studio:

> >>> std::cout << "Hello\n";
> >>> std::wcout << "Hello\n";
> >>> std::cout << L"Hello\n";
> >>> std::wcout << L"Hello\n";

> >>> If cout and wcout can handle both char strings and wide char
> >>> strings

> >> By default std::cout can't handle wide text (see Sam's reply
> >> else-thread).

> > Sam didn't make it clear what the problem is. In a conforming
> > implementation, you can't output wide character text to
> > std::cout, period.

> Of course you can. Or, perhaps not you you. But anyone else.
> :-)

Really. How?

> > It shouldn't compile.

> Oh, well. I kindof agree with that. Unfortunately, compilers don't.

Actually, I was wrong there. It should compile, but once
compiled, it doesn't do what you want: when you pass a wchar_t*
to std::cout, you get an implicit conversion to void*, and it
outputs the address of the string, not the contents. At least,
according to the standard, and the three compilers I have ready
access too (g++, Sun CC and VC++).

> >>> then why do we need wcout?

> >> We don't, not in the form it has (translating to narrow
> >> characters). It's an abomination, a monstrosity, a completely
> >> redundant appendix in the acidic digestive system of C++, the
> >> system which end-product is... well, u know. ;-)

> > I'm not sure what your point is.

> Mostly that wcout is an abomination, a monstrosity, so on.

I know. You don't like iostream. For at least certain aspects
of the wide character streams, I agree with you. But that's
neither here nor there. We need something to do the job.

> Given that anyone would want to use std::cout, then that's
> where conversion from various types to sequences of bytes is
> handled. There's no reason to have a separate stream for just
> one special small set of types; it's so stupid that it isn't
> even wrong.

I fail to understand what you're saying. The wide character
streams don't deal in sequences of bytes at all; they deal in
sequences of wchar_t. And while the standard says that wchar_t
can be a char (in which case, wide character streams are rather
useless), that's not the case on any of the machines I have
ready access to.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 2:22 am
From: "Alf P. Steinbach"

* James Kanze:
> On Jun 28, 10:58 pm, "Alf P. Steinbach" <al...@start.no> wrote:
>> * James Kanze:
>>> On Jun 27, 10:17 pm, "Alf P. Steinbach" <al...@start.no> wrote:
>>>> * Amit Kumar:
>
>>>>> Output of all the four statements are the same on Visual
>>>>> studio:
>
>>>>> std::cout << "Hello\n";
>>>>> std::wcout << "Hello\n";
>>>>> std::cout << L"Hello\n";
>>>>> std::wcout << L"Hello\n";
>
>>>>> If cout and wcout can handle both char strings and wide char
>>>>> strings
>
>>>> By default std::cout can't handle wide text (see Sam's reply
>>>> else-thread).
>
>>> Sam didn't make it clear what the problem is. In a conforming
>>> implementation, you can't output wide character text to
>>> std::cout, period.
>
>> Of course you can. Or, perhaps not you you. But anyone else.
>> :-)
>
> Really. How?

Depends on what you mean by 'output'.

If you mean the act of passing e.g. a wchar_t const* as argument and getting
some byte sequence as result, then you have that without doing anything, which
is part of what the "you can" means, but the result is not very useful, which is
what the "can't handle" meant -- on the way you changed the context a little.

If you want a more sensible conversion to byte sequence define an operator<<
overload, for example.

>>> It shouldn't compile.
>
>> Oh, well. I kindof agree with that. Unfortunately, compilers don't.
>
> Actually, I was wrong there. It should compile, but once
> compiled, it doesn't do what you want: when you pass a wchar_t*
> to std::cout, you get an implicit conversion to void*, and it
> outputs the address of the string, not the contents. At least,
> according to the standard, and the three compilers I have ready
> access too (g++, Sun CC and VC++).
>
>>>>> then why do we need wcout?
>
>>>> We don't, not in the form it has (translating to narrow
>>>> characters). It's an abomination, a monstrosity, a completely
>>>> redundant appendix in the acidic digestive system of C++, the
>>>> system which end-product is... well, u know. ;-)
>
>>> I'm not sure what your point is.
>
>> Mostly that wcout is an abomination, a monstrosity, so on.
>
> I know. You don't like iostream. For at least certain aspects
> of the wide character streams, I agree with you. But that's
> neither here nor there. We need something to do the job.

Yes, and it seems the error of the committee on this one was to take something
rather silly, look at it, "hey, this is something", and concluding, from the
earlier established need for something, that therefore the silly was needed.

>> Given that anyone would want to use std::cout, then that's
>> where conversion from various types to sequences of bytes is
>> handled. There's no reason to have a separate stream for just
>> one special small set of types; it's so stupid that it isn't
>> even wrong.
>
> I fail to understand what you're saying. The wide character
> streams don't deal in sequences of bytes at all; they deal in
> sequences of wchar_t.

Nope, the appearance that they deal in wchar_t sequences is just appearance,
cosmetics, complication. It may have been the original intention, who knows. But
what they /do/ is to convert to byte (char) sequences, the same as the narrow
streams, and with the same destinations.

So why should one have to deal with 2 streams converting two slightly different
sets of types to char sequences on standard output, instead of just 1 stream
converting any of those types to char sequences on standard output?

There is no answer to that, for the design is just meaningless.

And this is easier to see with C++0x, which introduces even more
character-oriented types, types like char and wchar_t.

Should one have one extra stream for each of those types, perhaps?

I haven't checked, but if the committee has done that then they've gone off
their collective rockers.

> And while the standard says that wchar_t
> can be a char (in which case, wide character streams are rather
> useless), that's not the case on any of the machines I have
> ready access to.

That's not the point.

- Alf

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: using typename
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/6866a2830b0d79e4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 1:56 am
From: "mlt"

In a class MyReg I have the below constructor:

//template<typename T>
class MyReg{
public:
...
typedef itk::Image< PixelType, Dimension > FixedImageType;
typedef itk::Image< PixelType, Dimension > MovingImageType;
typedef itk::ImageFileReader< FixedImageType > FixedImageReaderType;
typedef itk::ImageFileReader< MovingImageType > MovingImageReaderType;

MyReg(MyParameters param, FixedImageReaderType::Pointer fixed,
MovingImageReaderType::Pointer moving){
this->param = param;
this->fixedImageReader = fixed;
this->movingImageReader = moving;
}

};

This compiles fine. But if I use the template declaration:

template<typename T>
class MyReg{
public:
...
...

I get the compiler error:

Error 2 error C2061: syntax error : identifier 'Pointer'

I have found that a fix is to add typename to the arguments in the
constructor:

MyReg(MyParameters param, typename FixedImageReaderType::Pointer fixed,
typename MovingImageReaderType::Pointer moving){

But why does this solve the problem? I have read that when typename is used
its to tell the compiler that follwing code is a type, but would that not be
obvious in a constructor?

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 2:10 am
From: Maxim Yegorushkin

mlt wrote:
> In a class MyReg I have the below constructor:
>
> //template<typename T>
> class MyReg{
> public:
> ...
> typedef itk::Image< PixelType, Dimension > FixedImageType;
> typedef itk::Image< PixelType, Dimension > MovingImageType;
> typedef itk::ImageFileReader< FixedImageType > FixedImageReaderType;
> typedef itk::ImageFileReader< MovingImageType > MovingImageReaderType;
>
> MyReg(MyParameters param, FixedImageReaderType::Pointer fixed,
> MovingImageReaderType::Pointer moving){
> this->param = param;
> this->fixedImageReader = fixed;
> this->movingImageReader = moving;
> }
>
> };
>
> This compiles fine. But if I use the template declaration:
>
> template<typename T>
> class MyReg{
> public:
> ...
> ...
>
> I get the compiler error:
>
> Error 2 error C2061: syntax error : identifier 'Pointer'
>
> I have found that a fix is to add typename to the arguments in the
> constructor:
>
>
> MyReg(MyParameters param, typename FixedImageReaderType::Pointer fixed,
> typename MovingImageReaderType::Pointer moving){
>
> But why does this solve the problem? I have read that when typename is used
> its to tell the compiler that follwing code is a type, but would that not be
> obvious in a constructor?

http://www.comeaucomputing.com/techtalk/templates/#typename

--
Max

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Proposal: More flexible comparisons
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/0666c63287aacf90?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 2:51 am
From: Hendrik Schober

Juha Nieminen wrote:
> Hendrik Schober wrote:
>> Victor Bazarov wrote:
>>> [...] You already can do
>>>
>>> #define is ^
>>> #define in Interval
>>> ...
>>> if (4 is in (1, 10))
>>> ...
>>>
>>> Preprocessor is not always your enemy.
>> Except that this wreaks havoc with code like this
>> std::istream& operator<<(std::istream& is, const T& o);
>> which isn't really uncommon.
>
> Preprocessor macros messing up things is a relatively common problem.
> For example, some versions of the C++ standard library implementation in
> MSVC defined min() and max() as macros. This naturally caused havoc
> anywhere you wanted to use those names, such as:
>
> namespace
> {
> MyType min(MyType a, MyType b) { return ...; }
> }

NOMINMAX

> I once used an enumerated constant named NO_ERROR (inside a class) in
> a library I made. Someone reported that this caused problems with some
> version of Borland C++ because some library in that compiler defined
> that name as a preprocessor macro.

But then identifiers in upper case are commonly used
for macros, so if you introduce one, you know you run
the risk of it being trampled over.
I find the habit to make constants all upper case odd,
and the only explanation I see for their existence is
that they are a left-over from the times when constants
really where macros. Get rid of that habit and have
less problems.

Schobi

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Deleting a pointer
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c++/t/6edfb5f5fe0c17db?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Mon, Jun 29 2009 3:06 am
From: Hendrik Schober

CplusplusNewbie wrote:
> I wonder why the authors of C++ didn't write the delete function so
> that, for example, the code delete p; stands for
>
> delete p; p = 0;
>
> That way, there would be no problem if pointers were deleted twice.
>
> Is there ever a situation where it would be problematic to set a
> pointer to 0 after deletion?

Why would you invoke 'delete' yourself?
In the last ten years, I've rarely written any 'delete' in
my code. When I did (count it on your fingers), it was in
the dtor of a class that owned the pointer, so it made no
sense to zero it.

> Thank you.

Schobi

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