- "Death to C, ++" - 17 Updates
- PEDOFILO ^SATA-N-AZISTA^ CLAUDIO CERASA (TWITTER E IL FOGLIO..FOGLIO..SI..MA DA USARE PER PULIRSI IL CULO SE SENZA CARTA IGIENICA..OCHO PERO'..E' PIENO DI NAZISMO E MAFIA)! PEDERASTA DI PALERMO AFFILIATO A COSA NOSTRA: FAMIGLIA ASSASSINA DEI CIMINNA! - 1 Update
- Difference between type(type) and type(*)(type) - 6 Updates
- The Day of Your Judgment - 1 Update
| Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com>: Jul 18 11:28PM > CPUs offer virtual memory, where the OS gives you a huge adressable > space. Underlying the virtual memory is the real memory, that could have > some GB in most machines. Heh, never thought to implement it like that ;) What about tree ? ;) In my experience in Rust you use raw pointers for everything that wrap it up in "safe" code ;) -- press any key to continue or any other to quit... |
| Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net>: Jul 18 08:56PM -0400 > Ebenezer Enterprises - I'm thankful for Jerry as he > has reminded me to be thankful for C++. > http://webEbenezer.net I do both. It just depends on the project, and if I'm working with a group, the skill set of the other programmers. -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry Stuckle jstucklex@attglobal.net ================== |
| bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net>: Jul 18 10:35PM -0400 On 07/18/2017 08:56 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote: >> http://webEbenezer.net > I do both. It just depends on the project, and if I'm working with a > group, the skill set of the other programmers. C got a bad rap because while it was developed before personal networking/Internet became commonplace, it was still used millions of times over with its regular insecure stdlib library implementations from 1983 or whenever in every type of product under the sun where anything and everything from God knows where on the network was allowed to "talk" directly with those functions. The author doesn't acknowledge however that there are many many applications where security from Internet attackers is just not a concern, where C is a perfectly appropriate systems programming language and the best tool for the job. My microwave oven doesn't need to talk to the Internet. My car's ECU doesn't need to talk to the Internet. My polyphonic digital synthesizer doesn't need to talk to the Internet. I've found that the x86 desktop/web coders I'm acquainted with are remarkably ignorant of "how things are" in the embedded world these days; oh an embedded processor? I thought you hand wrote asm for those? Good grief no, we use C and C++ the same as anyone else. Yes you can use C++ on a modern 32 (or 16, or even 8) bit microcontroller. No it's not slow. Yes you can use templates and virtual functions and OOP. The complaint basically seems to be that what is essentially a bare-metal systems programming language isn't also intrinsically good at sanitizing weird-ass SQL injection attacks or whatever coming in over a network infrastructure 30 years more advanced than the language itself. Um duh? Your blazing fast bare-metal code shouldn't be in charge of gatekeeping too, that's not its job. "What I'm advocating for is much simpler: surgically replace weaker parts but keep most of the project intact. […] You can actually take a piece of C code inside an existing project, import the C structures and functions to access them from Rust, rewrite the code in Rust, export the functions and structures from Rust, compile it and link it with the rest of the project." If you need both blazing speed and strong security delegating responsibility like that is sort of what one should have been doing all along, yeah? Multiplayer game engines have been doing this for years, sandboxing the users away from the high performance graphics/physics code by only allowing interaction with it thru a well-defined set of calls processed by a scripting language/virtual machine. |
| legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard): Jul 19 03:20AM [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup] Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> spake the secret code >"Death to C, ++" Meh. Glancing through the article, the author seems to conflate C with C++. Every time a programmer in another language tells me how horribly unmaintainable C++ code is based on some experience in their company, I ask them to show me the code. The code is invariably C code (or C++ written in C code style). I'm sorry, but I can't help you if you insist on using bad programming habits that were obsolete at the time C++ was first released for general use in the mid 80s. If this is your problem, then switching languages won't help. You can write horrible code in any language. If you don't know how to write maintainable code, then no language can help you. It is possible to write maintainable, secure, testable, etc., code in C. It is easier in C++ to achieve those goals than it is in C IMO. Every time I'm forced to go back and program in C, I remember why I left it for C++ in the early 90s. Languages have never been, and IMO never will be, silver bullets that solve all your problems. Java didn't solve everyone's problems and neither did C#. Similarly, neither did Modula-2, Ada, RPG II, FORTRAN, LISP, Erlang, Clojure, etc., etc. Each of these languages have their own strenths and weaknesses and using them appropriately is part of being a polyglot programmer. Trying to find one language to rule them all is a silly endeavour. -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" free book <http://tinyurl.com/d3d-pipeline> The Terminals Wiki <http://terminals-wiki.org> The Computer Graphics Museum <http://computergraphicsmuseum.org> Legalize Adulthood! (my blog) <http://legalizeadulthood.wordpress.com> |
| jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>: Jul 19 10:59AM +0200 Le 19/07/2017 à 05:20, Richard a écrit : > horribly unmaintainable C++ code is based on some experience in their > company, I ask them to show me the code. The code is invariably C > code (or C++ written in C code style). Thanks for repeating the mantra of all incompetent C++ programmers: C is bad. Yeah. And that is not backed up with any real data. Just stories as they like to tell, to mask their lies. There is not a single thread of evidence that C code is "unmaintainable" any more than C++ code is. C is readable, C++ is NOT. You just cannot go into all those nested templates, classes, whatever. You MUST use the debugger to see where that code is going. This is a fact. |
| Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>: Jul 19 10:00PM +1200 On 07/19/17 08:59 PM, jacobnavia wrote: > any more than C++ code is. C is readable, C++ is NOT. > You just cannot go into all those nested templates, classes, whatever. > You MUST use the debugger to see where that code is going. I don't... I look at C and C++ code with the same source browser. Foreign code is equally opaque no matter the language. -- Ian |
| Manfred <noname@invalid.add>: Jul 19 12:57PM +0200 On 7/19/2017 5:20 AM, Richard wrote: > code (or C++ written in C code style). I'm sorry, but I can't help > you if you insist on using bad programming habits that were obsolete > at the time C++ was first released for general use in the mid 80s. I don't share your blame for C, but I agree that the author is wrong in his perspective of C and C++ - obviously he does not know them well enough, if in 2017 he keeps on conflating them into each other. One thing that C and C++ share in common is that they are both languages that are not meant to be handled superficially or without enough knowledge. They give a lot of potential to the programmer, but the programmer is expected to know what he/she is doing - the criticism of the author seems pretty much stemming from missing this point. IMHO the superficiality of the author also emerges when he reports that the single best feature of C is "getting down to the bare metal and working at mach speed" Specifically about code security, I also do not agree that C and C++ (at their respective levels) are inherently unsafe. If used properly, in their respective area of operation, code written on these languages is very well safe, actually it can be safer than other languages that rely on some runtime that is out of the control of the programmer. AFAIK the Linux kernel is one of the safest available, and it is entirely written in C/asm, not a single line in Rust or any other fancy language that is supposed to "oxidize away" C (and C++) |
| jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>: Jul 19 01:21PM +0200 Le 19/07/2017 à 12:00, Ian Collins a écrit : >> You just cannot go into all those nested templates, classes, whatever. >> You MUST use the debugger to see where that code is going. > I don't... I look at C and C++ code with the same source browser. Well, that confirms what I said. You need a machine to see where it is going. Yes, a source code browsing software will tell you where is going, the same as the debugger. |
| Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>: Jul 19 11:24PM +1200 On 07/19/17 11:21 PM, jacobnavia wrote: > Well, that confirms what I said. You need a machine to see where it is > going. Yes, a source code browsing software will tell you where is > going, the same as the debugger. As I said, the same for both C and C++. -- Ian |
| Mr Flibble <flibbleREMOVETHISBIT@i42.co.uk>: Jul 19 02:29PM +0100 On 18/07/2017 18:34, Lynn McGuire wrote: > But, if one cannot walk the tightrope then one should find something > else to do in life. After all, working on the high wire is not for > everyone. That short article is not only lazy, it is egregious. There is no such language as C/C++. Security exploits are a lot harder to accidentally create in C++ than in C if you use C++ properly (RAII, iterators etc). /Flibble |
| Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net>: Jul 19 09:40AM -0400 On 7/19/2017 4:59 AM, jacobnavia wrote: > You just cannot go into all those nested templates, classes, whatever. > You MUST use the debugger to see where that code is going. > This is a fact. The same is true of any library code for any language. The whole idea of object oriented programming is you don't HAVE to know what happens inside - the object takes care of itself. How do you determine the system computes pow(3.4,5.6)? -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry Stuckle jstucklex@attglobal.net ================== |
| Bill Dugan <wkdugan@ix.netcom.com>: Jul 19 07:37AM -0700 On Tue, 18 Jul 2017 20:56:43 -0400, Jerry Stuckle >> http://webEbenezer.net >I do both. It just depends on the project, and if I'm working with a >group, the skill set of the other programmers. An important factor which most of the posts here have been ignoring. The writer is almost never the last person to touch the code, and shouldn't assume too much about the skill of someone modifying it years later. |
| jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>: Jul 19 05:52PM +0200 Le 19/07/2017 à 15:40, Jerry Stuckle a écrit : > How do you determine the system computes pow(3.4,5.6)? log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) 5.6 That means the system is working OK. |
| "Öö Tiib" <ootiib@hot.ee>: Jul 19 09:05AM -0700 On Wednesday, 19 July 2017 18:52:54 UTC+3, jacobnavia wrote: > log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) > 5.6 > That means the system is working OK. On case of gcc it more likely shows that the compiler is cheating. Just tried on gcc 7.1.0: static_assert(log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) == 5.6, "Magic must work"); Compiles. |
| bartc <bc@freeuk.com>: Jul 19 05:30PM +0100 On 19/07/2017 16:52, jacobnavia wrote: > log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) > 5.6 > That means the system is working OK. Not necessarily: #include <stdio.h> double pow(double x,double y){return x*y;} double log(double x){return x;} int main(void) { printf("%f\n", log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4)); } Output: 5.60000 -- bartc |
| Real Troll <real.troll@trolls.com>: Jul 19 01:25PM -0400 On 19/07/2017 17:30, bartc wrote: > printf("%f\n", log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4)); > } > Output: 5.60000 Why do you say "Not necessarily? you mixing the two functions: pow is just power of a number while log is the log of the number so clearly the answer you get is correct. I just ran it in VS2017 and this is what I got: pow(3.4, 5.6) = 946.851639 Log ( pow(3.4, 5.6) ) = 6.853142 log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) = 5.600000 Press any key to continue . . . This is the full program: #include <stdio.h> #include <math.h> int main(void) { double num1 = pow(3.4, 5.6); printf("pow(3.4, 5.6) = %f \n", num1); double num2 = log(num1); printf("Log ( pow(3.4, 5.6) ) = %f \n", num2); double num3 = log(num1) / log(3.4); printf("log(pow(3.4,5.6))/log(3.4) = %f\n", num3); return 0; } |
| Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com>: Jul 19 06:50PM +0100 > There is not a single thread of evidence that C code is > "unmaintainable" any more than C++ code is. C is readable, C++ is NOT. Thanks for repeating the mantra of all incompetent C++ programmers: |
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DI STA TOPAIA FASCIOMAFIOSA FACEVAN PARTE IN PIENO E STRA PIENO, IL PEDERASTA E MEGA RICICLA SOLDI DI STIDDA E COSA NOSTRA, RICCARDO CASATTA DI CRIMINALISSIME ETERNITY WALL E BLOCKCHAINLAB https://it.linkedin.com/in/riccardocasatta ED IL, NOTO A LONDRA COME " THE CRIMINAL BEAST", PORCO CRIMINALISSIMO THOMAS BERTANI DI ORACLIZE https://uk.linkedin.com/in/thomasbertani UNA DELLE PRINCIPALI LAVATRICI DI CASH KILLER DI MAFIA, CAMORRA, NDRANGHETA, MALAVITE DI MEZZO MONDO NELLA CITY LONDINESE (I DUE PONGONO A DISPOSIZIONE AD ASSASSINI SU ASSASSINI DI TUTTO IL PIANETA TERRA, I MEGA LAVA CASH MAFIOSO SISTEMI BLOCKCHAIN E BITCOIN http://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/commenti-e-idee/2017-01-24/bitcoin-riciclaggio-invisibile-mafie-e-terrorismo-internazionale-164825.shtml?uuid=AEISiAH https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/jan/20/bitcoin-netherlands-arrests-cars-cash-ecstasy) PARTE DELLA NAZIGANG E' IN STRA PIENO IL BASTARDO FASCIORAZZISTA E MEGA RICICLA SOLDI MAFIOSI, GIACOMO ZUCCO DI CRIMINALISSIMA BHB-BLOCKCHAINLAB, BLOCKCHAINLABIT, ASSOB.IT E WMO SA PANAMA (OLTRE CHE DI CITATI KU KLUK KLANISTI TEA PARTIES). TRATTASI DI ALTRO CIUCCIA CAZZI MORTI DI SILVIO BERLUSCONI, CHE, PER LO STESSO PEDOFILO SPAPPOLA MAGISTRATI SILVIO BERLUSCONI, MEGA RICICLA SOLDI KILLER DI BEN 7 NDRINE BASATE NEL MILANESE (FRA CUI LA MEGA SANGUINARIA NDRINA DI SANTO PASQUALE MORABITO). COME DELL'EFFERATO KILLER CAMORRISTA SALVATORE POTENZA! AND THEN AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN... FAN PARTE DI QUESTA GANG NAZINDRANGHETISTA, IL PARI PEDERASTA MAURIZIO BARBERO DI TECHNOSKY MONTESETTEPANI https://it.linkedin.com/in/maurizio-barbero-a521978 (CHE ERA CIO' CHE UNIVA IL BASTARDO HITLERIANO GIULIO OCCHIONERO AD ENAV http://www.ilfattoquotidiano.it/2017/01/13/giulio-occhionero-un-cyberspione-che-piu-maldestro-non-si-puo/3312745/ http://www.repubblica.it/cronaca/2017/01/10/news/cyberspionaggio_inchiesta-155753314/ DI CUI, NON PER NIENTE, TECHNOSKY MONTESETTEPANI, SOCIETA' CONTROLLATA DA SERVIZI SEGRETI DI ESTREMA DESTRA, SPESSISSIMO ANCHE ASSASSINI, E' IN PIENO, PARTE). IL NOTO RICICLA SOLDI MAFIOSI MATTEO PARDU DI CRIMINALISSIMO STUDIO DI COMMERCIALISTI DEL SOLDATO DI LA SPEZIA! https://it.linkedin.com/in/matteo-pardu-90658820 LA NOTISSIMA PEDOFILA ELISA COGNO DI FRUIMEX SAS ALBA E TORINO. http://www.impresaitalia.info/mstdb80753147/fruimex-di-cogno-elisa-e-c-sas/alba.aspx http://jenkins-ci.361315.n4.nabble.com/SBORRATA-TUTTA-NEL-CULO-ELISA-COGNO-FRUIMEX-ALBA-TORINO-BLOGSPOT-TROIA-SATA-N-AZISTA-CHE-DIFFAMA-SUL-td4895643.html LA NOTISSIMA PEDOFILA, TANTO QUANTO, PIERA CLERICO DI FRUIMEX SAS ALBA E TORINO. http://jenkins-ci.361315.n4.nabble.com/BASTARDISSIMA-TROIA-PIERA-CLERICO-FRUIMEX-A-CAPO-ANZI-A-quot-KAPO-quot-DI-TANTE-SETTE-SATANISTE-ANZI-td4897000.html AND THERE WE GO AGAIN AND AGAIN: IL PARI PEDERASTA AZZERA RISPARMI FEDERICO IZZI DETTO ZIO ROMOLO ( MEGA RICICLA CASH MALAVITOSO DEI GIRI LERCI DI MAFIA CAPITALE E DI CAMORRISTI PRESENTI NEL BASSO LAZIO https://meloniclaudio.wordpress.com/2016/12/30/la-camorra-a-roma-e-nel-lazio/ http://www.adnkronos.com/fatti/cronaca/2016/03/04/blitz-contro-camorra-nel-casertano-nel-basso-lazio-arresti_Ee3CRNYmUmhxiTgmJJK3kI.html ). IL PARI PEDERASTA E MEGA RICICLA SOLDI MAFIOSI ANDREA SCARSI DI BANCA IFIGEST MILANO https://it.linkedin.com/in/andrea-scarsi-67a04a9 https://www.yatedo.com/p/Andrea+Scarsi/normal/1849658805458f948a8d95eb518850a4 IN PASSATO PURE A TRAFFICARE IN MONTE PASCHI AL FINE DI EFFETTUARE LA MEGA RUBERIA MASSONICO-NAZIFASCISTA POSTA IN ESSERE DAL PORCO GIUSEPPE MUSSARI http://www.ilfattoquotidiano.it/2016/10/01/mps-processo-milano-ex-vertici-giuseppe-mussari-antonio-vigni-e-gianluca-baldassarri/3069322/ FIGLIO DI NOTISSIMO GINECOLOGO SATANISTA E PEDOFILO ALESSANDRO SCARSI DI LATINA, CHE UCCIDEVA BAMBINI PER LEVARGLI ORGANI DA VENDERE, CHE STUPRAVA E FACEVA ABORTIRE PROSITUTE MINORENNI ALBANESI A GOGO E CHE PER TUTTO QUESTO E' FINITO IN GALERA http://www.telefree.it/news.php?op=view&id=2285 https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/it.hobby.fai-da-te/V_4dMdeCZQA PER NON PARLARE DEI PRIMA CITATI: NOTA PEDOFILA ANSELMA DEL'OLIO (SPOSATA COL VICE KAPO' E VICE CAPO DEI VERMI PRIMA CITATI: GIULIANO FERRARA). ED IL GIA' ARRESTATO PER AVER STUPRATO BAMBINI DI 11 ANNI, REGISTA BRESCIANO PEDERASTA GIUSEPPE LAZZARI!!! http://milano.repubblica.it/cronaca/2016/08/09/news/pedofilia-145677361/ NON PER NIENTE... FRA ANSELMA DELL'OLIO E GIUSEPPE LAZZARI, VI FURONO MOLTE SLINGUATE "PEDOFILESCO-MEDIATICHE", NEGLI ULTIMI ANNI, TIPO QUESTA http://video.corriere.it/sesso-11enne-arrestato-regista-giuseppe-lazzari-l-intervista-rai/4287e44c-5e41-11e6-bfed-33aa6b5e1635 MA ORA... COME CANTAVA LA GRANDISSIMA LYNN COLLINS, PRODOTTA DALL'ANCORA PIU' GRANDE JAMES BROWN... "AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN"!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB5KgOXHcxc NASCONDETE I VOSTRI FIGLI, PLEASE, DA NOTO AVVOCATO PEDOFIL-O-MOSESSUALE DANIELE MINOTTI (FACEBOOK)! NOTISSIMO AVVOCATO PEDERASTA INCULA BAMBINI DANIELE MINOTTI DI RAPALLO E GENOVA (DA ANNI ED ANNI ISCRITTO PRESSO GLI ANIMALI PAZZI CHE STUPRANO ADOLESCENTI E BIMBI, OSSIA I PORCI DEPRAVATISSIMI DI " ORGOGLIO PEDOFILO" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Man/Boy_Love_Association)! E' SUA LA SETTA DI SATANISTI STUPRA BIMBI CON DENTRO IL REGISTA, PURE PEDOFILO, GIUSEPPE LAZZARI (ARRESTATO), LA NOTA PEDOFILA TANTO QUANTO, ANSELMA DELL'OLIO ( CHE, COME AVETE VISTO E RI VEDRETE IN UN VIDEO QUI A SEGUITO, DA' DEL GENIO, DA' DEL FENOMENO, DI CONTINUO, AL SUO COMPARE DI ORGE SODOMIZZA RAGAZZINI: GIUSEPPE LAZZARI). ED IL, NOTORIAMENTE, DA SEMPRE PEDOFIL-O-MOSESSUALE GIULIANO FERRARA! COME IL PEDERASTA AFFILIATO A COSA NOSTRA, IL VISCIDO VERME CLAUDIO CERASA, NATO A PALERMO IL 7.5.1982, PARTE DELLA FAMIGLIA MEGASSASSINA CIMINNA DI CACCAMO. E PROPRIO IN QUANTO PARTE DI COSA NOSTRA E DA VARI ANNI, POSTO DAI, DA SEMPRE EDITORI MAFIOSI UBER ALLES, SILVIO BERLUSCONI E GIULIANO FERRARA, IN GOPPA AL FOGLIO (DA USARE SEMPRE E SOLO QUANDO FINISCE LA CARTA IGIENICA, MA CON ACCORTEZZA, PLEASE: E' UN FOGLIO INFETTATO DA CRIMINI DI OGNI, NON SOLO MEDIATICI, NON SOLO FRUTTO DELLE PIU' DELINQUENZIALI FAKE NEWS, MA ANCHE CRIMINI ASSASSINI, TERRORISTICI DI ESTREMA DESTRA, NAZIFASCISTI, MAFIOSI, CAMORRISTI, NDRANGHETISTI)! SI, E' PROPRIO TUTTO COSI': LO HANNO BECCATO UN'ALTRA VOLTA A STO SCHIFOSO SATANISTA, ANZI, A STO SCHIFOSO SATA-N-AZISTA PEDOFIL-O-MOSESSUALE DI DANIELE MINOTTI, AVVOCATO CRIMINALISSIMO DI RAPALLO E GENOVA ( GIA' AI TEMPI A FARE ORGE PEDOFIL-O-MOSESSUALI CON DON RICCARDO SEPPIA http://grokbase.com/t/python/python-list/148jckyh1w/avvocato-pedofilomosessuale-ed-assassino-daniele-minotti-facebook-oltre-che-nazi-megalava-euro-mafiosi-e-come-detto-mandante-di-omicidi-o-suicidate-stalker-di-eroe-civile-michele-nista-su-ordine-di-tiranno-fasciocamorrista-silvio-berlusconi STUDIO DI CRIMINALISSIMO PEDERASTA DANIELE MINOTTI Sede di Rapallo (GE) Via della Libertà, 4/10 – 16035 RAPALLO (GE) Tel. +39 0185 57880 Sede di Genova Via XX Settembre 3/13 16121 – GENOVA) CHE EFFETTUA ANCHE, DA SEMPRE, TANTO RICICLAGGIO DI DENARO MAFIOSO, COME PURE ROVINA O TERMINA LA VITA DI GENTE PER BENISSIMO (ANCHE ORDINANDO OMICIDI), ATTRAVERSO COMPLOTTI MASSO-N-AZIFASCISTI, OSSIA, DI LOGGE SATANICHE DI ESTREMISSIMA DESTRA. STO VERME SCHIFOSO DI DANIELE MINOTTI FACEVA PARTE DI UNA SETTA DI PEDERASTA BERLUSCONICCHI! IL CUI CAPO-KAPO' E' OVVIAMENTE LO SBAUSCIA TROIE BAMBINE MAROCCHINE, NONCHE' SPAPPOLA MAGISTRATI, PEDOFILO NUMERO UNO AL MONDO: SILVIO BERLUSCONI! SUO CAROGNESCO MANDANTE DI MILLE CRIMINALITA' E STALKING VIA WEB! ASSOLUTA METASTASI ASSASSINA E MONDIALE DI DEMOCRAZIA, LIBERTA' E GIUSTIZIA! http://www.huffingtonpost.it/2015/03/26/intervista-gianni-boncompagni_n_6945522.html http://www.cappittomihai.com/tag/pedofilo/ http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/silvio-berlusconi-paid-10m-bribes-bunga-bunga-girls-paedophile-prostitution-trial-1508692 http://www.magicrules.pw/2013/Jul/18/16000.html SEGUITO A RUOTA DAL MEGA SACCO STRA COLMO DI |
| Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid>: Jul 19 07:11AM Could someone explain to me in detai the exact difference between the syntaxes "type(type)" and "type(*)(type)"? It's still unclear to me. The difference is illustrated with this example: std::function<bool(const char*, const char*)> f1; // ok std::function<bool(*)(const char*, const char*)> f2 // error std::map<const char*, int, bool(*)(const char*, const char*)> m1; // ok std::map<const char*, int, bool(const char*, const char*)> m2; // error |
| "Alf P. Steinbach" <alf.p.steinbach+usenet@gmail.com>: Jul 19 10:08AM +0200 On 19.07.2017 09:11, Juha Nieminen wrote: > Could someone explain to me in detai the exact difference between the > syntaxes "type(type)" and "type(*)(type)"? It's still unclear to me. The first is a function type. Call that F. The second is the type pointer to function, i.e. F*. A function type can also be used to form a reference to function type, F& (and although it's unconventional to pass raw functions by reference it guarantees that if the code is valid you will never get a nullpointer, so no need to check that, which is nice). With post-C11 C++ notation you can name F and F_ptr like this: using F = auto(type) -> type; using F_ptr = F*; With C++03 notation you can name F and F_ptr like this: typedef type F(type); typedef F* F_ptr; > The difference is illustrated with this example: > std::function<bool(const char*, const char*)> f1; // ok > std::function<bool(*)(const char*, const char*)> f2 // error `std::function` needs a function type, not a function pointer type. If all you have is a function pointer type then dereference it and use `decltype` on the result. I think `std::function` should just have accepted both function type and function pointer type, but, that's not how it turned out. > std::map<const char*, int, bool(*)(const char*, const char*)> m1; // ok > std::map<const char*, int, bool(const char*, const char*)> m2; // error A function type is a non-instantiable type, like `void`. Well not quite (`void` is an incomplete type, and `void*` is a different /kind/ of pointer than `F*`, not formally compatible in C++03, and only optionally compatible in C++11 and later, to support Posix) but you get the picture, I hope. So, you can't use a function type to declare a data member, such as, here, the key in a `std::map`'s value type `std::pair`. Cheers & hth., - Alf |
| "Alf P. Steinbach" <alf.p.steinbach+usenet@gmail.com>: Jul 19 10:11AM +0200 On 19.07.2017 10:08, Alf P. Steinbach wrote: > member, such as, here, the key in a `std::map`'s value type `std::pair`. I mean value, not key, sorry. (Mumbles something about eye-sight and various stuff.) Cheers!, - Alf |
| Manfred <noname@invalid.add>: Jul 19 01:07PM +0200 On 7/19/2017 10:08 AM, Alf P. Steinbach wrote: > compatible in C++11 and later, to support Posix) but you get the > picture, I hope. So, you can't use a function type to declare a data > member, such as, here, the key in a `std::map`'s value type `std::pair`. // 23.4.4, class template map template <class Key, class T, class Compare = default_order_t<Key>, class Allocator = allocator<pair<const Key, T>>> The function pointer here would be the "Compare" template argument. |
| "Alf P. Steinbach" <alf.p.steinbach+usenet@gmail.com>: Jul 19 01:56PM +0200 On 19.07.2017 13:07, Manfred wrote: > template <class Key, class T, class Compare = default_order_t<Key>, > class Allocator = allocator<pair<const Key, T>>> > The function pointer here would be the "Compare" template argument. Thanks. I'm ordering new eyes as I type. Cheers!, - Alf |
| Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid>: Jul 19 03:57PM > template <class Key, class T, class Compare = default_order_t<Key>, > class Allocator = allocator<pair<const Key, T>>> > The function pointer here would be the "Compare" template argument. I suppose Alf's answer was correct in the sense that a typical implementation of std::map will instantiate the comparator type as a member variable (for example the implementation in libc++ does this, and I'm assuming the one in libstdc++ does too). It assigns the value it gets as a constructor parameter there (if one is given). I suppose a "function type" simply is a special type that cannot be instantiated by itself (even though normally types can be). |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Jul 19 06:37AM -0700 On Tuesday, July 18, 2017 at 10:36:57 AM UTC-4, Rick C. Hodgin wrote: > There is a corollary thread on comp.lang.c: > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.lang.c/1F8H2QfQDdM/We0vZ8G6BwAJ > Some questions have been asked and answered. It is informative. And again: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.lang.c/1F8H2QfQDdM/yKQUy8V-AgAJ Thank you, Rick C. Hodgin |
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