- Is rust going to replace C++ - 14 Updates
- Read again.. - 1 Update
- C++ or Rust ? - 1 Update
- copying an aggregate (array) - 2 Updates
- My name is Rick - 1 Update
- Consider your future - 3 Updates
- Push_back works, but emplace_back doesn't, when constructing with initialiser list - 1 Update
- Telephone - 2 Updates
| bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net>: Dec 03 08:44PM -0500 > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Rick (rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com) is not welcome to this post. He is a fucking asshole, keep spamming different newsgroups > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No |
| red floyd <no.spam@its.invalid>: Dec 03 07:23PM -0800 > Please don't swear here. Take your self righteousness and fuck off. |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Dec 03 07:31PM -0800 On Sunday, December 3, 2017 at 10:24:03 PM UTC-5, red floyd wrote: > > Please don't swear here. > Take your self righteousness and .. off. It's not self-righteousness. It's common decenc and a respect for God who teaches us to shun profanity for it will only lead to increasing ungodliness (as you know and can see in the behavior of people). God has a better plan and purpose for us than obscene things. -- Rick C. Hodgin |
| Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>: Dec 04 04:38PM +1300 On 12/04/2017 04:31 PM, Rick C. Hodgin wrote: >>> Please don't swear here. >> Take your self righteousness and .. off. > It's not self-righteousness. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/05/04/swearing-really-good/ http://www.menshealth.co.uk/healthy/stress/i-swear-its-good-for-you -- Ian. |
| Daniel <danielaparker@gmail.com>: Dec 03 08:09PM -0800 On Sunday, December 3, 2017 at 10:24:03 PM UTC-5, red floyd wrote: > > Please don't swear here. > Take your self righteousness and fuck off. I think Brian was making a joke :-) |
| Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com>: Dec 04 04:47AM > who teaches us to shun profanity for it will only lead to increasing > ungodliness (as you know and can see in the behavior of people). > God has a better plan and purpose for us than obscene things. Everything is shitting except pissing, and pissing is shitting when you piss up the wind! -- press any key to continue or any other to quit... |
| Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid>: Dec 04 08:10AM > Is rust going to replace C++? The world seems want to stay in C++ "Better C++'s" have been introduced over the past 20 or so years. Some of them have succeeded on their own (like Java and C#), others have simply faded to obscurity. None have succeeded in replacing C++ so far. Somehow I doubt that will change this time either. |
| David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>: Dec 04 09:37AM +0100 On 04/12/17 05:09, Daniel wrote: >> Take your self righteousness and fuck off. > I think Brian was making a joke :-) If only that were true! Brian and Rick are on crusades, with such blind, arrogant self-righteousness that they don't see that they are totally counter-productive. No one with their head screwed on right could imagine that Brian's knee-jerk posts would reduce swearing, or that Rick would convince anyone to join his weird cult. |
| Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net>: Dec 04 12:52PM -0500 On 12/3/2017 3:54 PM, Vir Campestris wrote: > and would work fine on the platform. > Some of that C code is in .cpp files :( > Andy I've also seen a lot of C++ code where C would be more appropriate. And yes, some of that is in .cpp files - but I like that because of the tighter restrictions of C++. It can help find some bugs that the looser typing of C doesn't. -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry Stuckle jstucklex@attglobal.net ================== |
| Chris Vine <chris@cvine--nospam--.freeserve.co.uk>: Dec 04 07:45PM On Sun, 3 Dec 2017 09:51:31 -0800 (PST) > Hi All > Is rust going to replace C++? The world seems want to stay in C++ I think it is the only new language around which stands a chance, and even then it might fail. It seems to be a seriously nice language, taking what seems to me to be the best of C++ and ML, together with an original approach to concurrency. Bringing memory safety into the type system whilst avoiding garbage collection seems novel, as also does bringing thread safety into the type system (a better solution in my view than languages which rely on functional purity[1]). It is also pleasing that is has got rid of the distinction in the ALGOL languages between expressions and statements - almost everything evaluates to something. Very few projects actually seem to use it at present. I have also never used it except in toy playing around in order to take a look at it. Chris [1] Whenever a result has to be passed from one thread to another, you cannot avoid impure synchronization events occurring. Better, in my view, to do what rust does and build it into the type system and except that fact. |
| Dombo <dombo@disposable.invalid>: Dec 04 09:27PM +0100 >>> Peter >> Please don't swear here. > I know you are cranky about what you consider swearing but which of the words (that you quoted, above) are you claiming to be "swearing"? Probably this part of the original message that woodbrain "conveniently" snipped: Rick (rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com) is not welcome to this post. He is a fucking asshole, keep spamming different newsgroups |
| Chris Vine <chris@cvine--nospam--.freeserve.co.uk>: Dec 04 08:36PM On Mon, 4 Dec 2017 21:27:57 +0100 > "conveniently" snipped: > Rick (rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com) is not welcome to this post. He is a > fucking asshole, keep spamming different newsgroups Technically speaking I think guinness.tony is correct, in that "he is a fucking asshole" is profane but not swearing. However standards have slipped in the mid-West and I believe that those who are of a tender disposition there might mistakenly apply the word "swearing" to it. Chris |
| Dombo <dombo@disposable.invalid>: Dec 04 09:44PM +0100 Op 04-Dec-17 om 20:45 schreef Chris Vine: > Very few projects actually seem to use it at present. I have also > never used it except in toy playing around in order to take a look at > it. Over the decades I've seen many new programming languages that promised to be the next big thing, yet only a very few stuck. My observation is that the qualities of the programming language itself is only minor factor for its success. Programming languages like C and C++ are neither pure nor elegant, yet despite their flaws and weaknesses are widely used. A much more important consideration is the ecosystem around the programming language; availability of libraries, tooling, information (forums, courses, conferences), availability of skilled programmers, commercial backing...etc are much more import factors to consider when choosing a programming language for a project. This makes hard for new programming languages to replace well established programming languages. |
| "James R. Kuyper" <jameskuyper@verizon.net>: Dec 04 03:41PM -0500 On 12/04/2017 03:27 PM, Dombo wrote: > snipped: > Rick (rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com) is not welcome to this post. He is a > fucking asshole, keep spamming different newsgroups I don't see messages posted by the person he was responding to, so I hadn't seen that part. That makes sense now. As someone who objects to such language, he quite reasonably does not want to quote it, either. However, he should at least have quoted it in explicitly redacted form, so people would have some idea what he was talking about. |
| Intelli2 <intelli2@mama.com>: Dec 04 03:40PM -0500 Hello.. Read this: === I have used Rust quite a bit and even managed to create a video course on it. While I enjoy Rust, it cannot really compete with C++ because: C++ is object-oriented, Rust isn't like C++. My observations about Rust: Simple OOP is easy, but you'll often find that straight procedural is simpler once you stop thinking of everything as an object. Abstract classes are not really possible, very clunky work-arounds. Say you have an Abstract class that implements 95% of the functionality, but you want your user to implement the last 5% and then supply the class to your library. This is easy to do in Rust, but requires the user to implement essentially a wrapper around the Abstract struct. It exposes a lot of ugly API to end-users. There are workarounds (using closures, etc) but the resulting API is ugly either way. Polymorphism and generics are non-trivial and requires hoop-jumping. The mental hurdle for me is that traits != types. I often find myself wanting to declare a variable as a trait: e.v. Vec<Amphibian>, where Amphibian is a trait. I want a vector of amphibians and don't care what the actual implementation is. You can't do this however. Instead, you often have to wrap everything in an enum and then dispatch methods to the underlying type. My observation about C++: The Intel compiler, terrible as it is, give the 'absolute most' performance in terms of SSE and auto-parallelism. I do find some of IPS tools gimmicky but the compiler gives the numeric performance I need. A good IDE (CLion and ReSharper C++) is an absolute must for me. Intel Parallel Studio tools such as VTune are epic and I don't see anything in the Rust space. C++ ecosystem has all the libs I need, even if I don't enjoy those APIs as much. For example, if I want motion graphics, I grab Direct2D/DirectWrite and FFMPEG and I'm good to go. Modern C++ is a lot of fun to learn and use, there's plenty of evolution of the language and a neat community. === Thank you, Amine Moulay Ramdane. |
| Intelli2 <intelli2@mama.com>: Dec 04 03:38PM -0500 Hello, Read this: === I have used Rust quite a bit and even managed to create a video course on it. While I enjoy Rust, it cannot really compete with C++ because: C++ is object-oriented, Rust isn't like C++. My observations about Rust: Simple OOP is easy, but you'll often find that straight procedural is simpler once you stop thinking of everything as an object. Abstract classes are not really possible, very clunky work-arounds. Say you have an Abstract class that implements 95% of the functionality, but you want your user to implement the last 5% and then supply the class to your library. This is easy to do in Rust, but requires the user to implement essentially a wrapper around the Abstract struct. It exposes a lot of ugly API to end-users. There are workarounds (using closures, etc) but the resulting API is ugly either way. Polymorphism and generics are non-trivial and requires hoop-jumping. The mental hurdle for me is that traits != types. I often find myself wanting to declare a variable as a trait: e.v. Vec<Amphibian>, where Amphibian is a trait. I want a vector of amphibians and don't care what the actual implementation is. You can't do this however. Instead, you often have to wrap everything in an enum and then dispatch methods to the underlying type. My observatoin about C++: The Intel compiler, terrible as it is, give the 'absolute most' performance in terms of SSE and auto-parallelism. I do find some of IPS tools gimmicky but the compiler gives the numeric performance I need. A good IDE (CLion and ReSharper C++) is an absolute must for me. Intel Parallel Studio tools such as VTune are epic and I don't see anything in the Rust space. C++ ecosystem has all the libs I need, even if I don't enjoy those APIs as much. For example, if I want motion graphics, I grab Direct2D/DirectWrite and FFMPEG and I'm good to go. Modern C++ is a lot of fun to learn and use, there's plenty of evolution of the language and a neat community. === Thank you, Amine Moulay Ramdane. |
| Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid>: Dec 04 08:01AM > The C++ standard cannot explicitly rule out every case of bad > programming practice, nor for that matter every possible case of > malicious coding by a psychopathic programmer The standard already states that names beginning with an underscore are reserved for the compiler, even tough there's absolutely nothing in the language preventing the user from breaking that convention. Because it's just that: A convention established by the standard. In the same way the standard could say that the namespace 'std', no matter where it appears (even if inside other namespaces) is reserved for the standard libraries. |
| Chris Vine <chris@cvine--nospam--.freeserve.co.uk>: Dec 04 08:28PM On Mon, 4 Dec 2017 08:01:42 -0000 (UTC) Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> wrote > are reserved for the compiler, even tough there's absolutely nothing > in the language preventing the user from breaking that convention. > Because it's just that: A convention established by the standard. It is coding standards which promulgate conventions. The standard promulgates The Law. Your summary is not quite right though. The standard prohibits global names beginning with an underscore, and locals beginning with an underscore followed by a capital letter or another underscore (or at least it used to if C++17 has changed that). > In the same way the standard could say that the namespace 'std', no > matter where it appears (even if inside other namespaces) is reserved > for the standard libraries. It could. But the cases are not equivalent. The rule about underscores is to enable compilers to be written. Any new rule about 'std' would be to try to prevent assholes from being assholes, something which is likely to fail. Chris |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Dec 04 05:38PM Hello, my name is Rick. I'm a pious self-righteous spamming prick. I will continue to spam this newsgroup until my incessant sanctimonious nagging has achieved its desired effect: the total born again conversion of all users of this newsgroup. The destruction of Usenet newsgroups is part of God's grand plan as Usenet is the Devil's work. -- Thank you, Rick C. Hodgin |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Dec 03 07:39PM -0800 Everybody dies. But not everybody needs to fear death. Read the New Testament. Read about Jesus Christ. Learn how He stepped out of Heaven, put on a body, came here as a man, to set us free from that which we could not set ourselves free from: sin. Learn how He wants to forgive you, give you eternal life, and have you be part of His Kingdom. He makes all things new. -- Rick C. Hodgin |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Dec 03 08:20PM -0800 On Sunday, December 3, 2017 at 10:40:03 PM UTC-5, Rick C. Hodgin wrote: > that which we could not set ourselves free from: sin. > Learn how He wants to forgive you, give you eternal life, and have you > be part of His Kingdom. He makes all things new. It occurred to me tonight that all people will either: (1) Stand before Jesus, being judged for your sin, or (2) Stand before Jesus-being-judged-for-your-sin. The choice is yours, but knowing that you are a sinner and that you do have sin, and that God's standard for entrance into Heaven is total and complete perfection, it will be better for you to ask Jesus to forgive your sin and give you eternal life. "Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." If you don't have faith, it's because you are reading the Bible with an honest, truthful, real-answer seeking heart. -- Rick C. Hodgin |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Dec 04 04:55AM -0800 On Sunday, December 3, 2017 at 11:20:40 PM UTC-5, Rick C. Hodgin wrote: > If you don't have faith, it's because you are reading the Bible with an > honest, truthful, real-answer seeking heart. Correction: If you don't have faith, it's because you ARE NOT reading the Bible with an honest, truthful, real-answer seeking heart. God reveals Himself to all who seek the truth. We cannot know Him otherwise. If you seek the truth and press in and pursue it, God knows you are doing this and He will come to meet you where you are and lead you to His Son so you can be forgiven and have eternal life. -- Rick C. Hodgin |
| Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid>: Dec 04 08:06AM > In the case foo.push_back(s{something}) what (default) constructor of s > is being called? Isn't {3,4} an initialiser list there too? s{3,4} is in this case an aggregate initialization, not an initializer_list. They use the exact same syntax, on purpose. Admittedly it can be a bit confusing sometimes. (They use the exact same syntax so that the user can "override" the aggregate initialization with a custom constructor.) |
| Mr Flibble <flibbleREMOVETHISBIT@i42.co.uk>: Dec 03 11:46PM I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. -- Bjarne Stroustrup |
| jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>: Dec 04 01:16AM +0100 Le 04/12/2017 à 00:46, Mr Flibble a écrit : > I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my > telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my > telephone. -- Bjarne Stroustrup Yes, if you use it as a computer, that could be a problem. I have an old iphone 4, 7 years old. Works like a charm, and after all those years I do not find it difficult to dial up and speak with it. I do not do anything else with that machine. Or maybe play a game of chess when I am in the train. Other phones seem more complicated. The new one it needs to look at you to verify you are the person you say you are... Sorry but that is quite ridiculous. I prefer the password. It is less ridiculous, for starters, and has the advantage of not staying looking at your phone like a stupid for ages... Look I do not like machines that try to mistify themselves. The computer is not "recognizing you" because it doesn't know who you are. Just blindly following some facial recognition software that could be made insecure at high probability by someone with a mask of your face. !!!!! How many software face recognition programs would fail to see a mask? I guess anything below 100% is highly exaggerated. :-) Yes, it has a database of facts that are centered around an "owner" software object somewhere. And it has pre-wired analysis of some situations written by the software writers. All that is quite OK, but facial recognition is just plain bad. A password is more secure and faster! |
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