- [OT] free will - 11 Updates
- constexpr array in template class undefined at link time - 2 Updates
| Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem>: Aug 26 05:09AM -0400 On Fri, 25 Aug 2017 18:12:43 +0000 > > self-defeating for God. Did an omniscient being make a mistake by > > giving man free will? > (Did you mean "omnipotent" here, BTW?) No. I meant God as all knowing (omniscient) entity should've known that giving man free will was a mistake in advance of him doing so. I.e., otherwise, he's not all knowing. I was implying that maybe God isn't an all knowing (omniscient) entity since God back-tracked and ordered man to not engage in certain acts of free will, e.g., by giving man the Ten Commandments. Once you claim that God is all powerful (omnipotent), all knowing (omniscient), and everywhere at once (omnipresent), you can basically disprove anything about God being a god, because he violates all three of these under numerous circumstances. The only way for God to comply with all three is if God is the Universe itself. Rod Pemberton -- Isn't anti-hate just hate by another name? Isn't anti-protesting just protesting by another name? Peace is a choice that both sides rejected. |
| Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem>: Aug 26 05:19AM -0400 On Fri, 25 Aug 2017 14:50:17 +0200 > schrieb Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem>: > [Your pointing out of the logical flaws in religious beliefs is quite > refreshing although I guess it's fruitless in Rick's case.] :-) I know. From Hinduism, "Satyannasti Parodharmati," meaning, "There is no religion greater than Truth." Rick's not the first stubbornly religious individual I've met in my life. I just want Rick to actually /THINK/ deeply about some of these things he says, not just accept them because it's part of his Faith. Normally, that which people don't believe to be true but tell to others anyway, is called a lie. But, Christians (probably Muslims and Jews too) repeat many things from the Bible they can't comprehend or don't believe or can't know for sure as being true. I.e., they lie, on behalf of God, in order to spread the Word of God, because they believe the Word of God is the truth. They call it taking it on Faith, not lying. Rick's a computer programmer which requires an infinite amount of logic and reason. That means an innate ability to accept facts and truth as it comes, not what you may wish it to be, nor what you believe. Yet, he accepts Christianity on Faith, without using his ability to think about what it truly says or means. Clearly, much of what it says is not valid in the present. He's thrown all logic and reason out the window in regards to Christianity. I don't fault a man who accepts God but who also understands that religion is man made. I fault a man with willful blindness, i.e., one who refuses to think about what he believes in and refuses to reject the non-sense. I.e., I see Rick as being in the dark, unwilling to accept the Truth. He rejects any truth contradictory to his belief. > teaches us that siblings or a mother and her child share 50% of their > DNA. Does that mean I am genetically closer to a chimp than to my own > mother? Of course not. The chimp is also only 50% of his mother. So, in totality, yes, because you have two parents, as does the chimp. In the next post, I. Shmakov said: > (I mean, we do have audience, right? I'm sure we aren't all > killfiled just yet!) I never filter anyone. You can't follow the conversation, if you do. While most people are 4%/96% troll/normal, many other people are 50%/50% troll/normal, maybe 70%/30% on c.l.c. Rick is a 50%/50% ... Rod Pemberton -- Isn't anti-hate just hate by another name? Isn't anti-protesting just protesting by another name? Peace is a choice that both sides rejected. |
| Ivan Shmakov <ivan@siamics.net>: Aug 26 12:12PM >>>>> Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> writes: >>>>> On Fri, 25 Aug 2017 18:12:43 +0000 Ivan Shmakov wrote: >>>>> Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> writes: I'm cross-posting this to news:alt.religion.christianity, as suggested by Richard Heathfield (news:onpsfd$k26$1@dont-email.me.) Please consider dropping the no longer (well, kind of) relevant Newsgroups: when following-up. (Let's see if this approach leads anywhere.) >> (Did you mean "omnipotent" here, BTW?) > No. > I meant God as all knowing (omniscient) entity should've known ACK; I understand this far. > God isn't an all knowing (omniscient) entity since God back-tracked > and ordered man to not engage in certain acts of free will, e. g., by > giving man the Ten Commandments. Actually, you imply here that God /may/ be not omniscient /and/ that "free will" might have been a mistake. (Or at least considered as such.) Is there any evidence for the latter? Also, there's a technicality: the Ten Commandments were given as part of the "contract" between God and His Chosen People; they had no bearing on the humanity at large at that point. You may want to refer to the Seven Laws of Noah instead. However, note that these are also part of a "public offer" of a kind: you obey them in order to secure a place for yourself in the /world to come/ once this world ends. If you desire no such /reward,/ there's no strict requirement to comply with them. Finally, were God to decide to take back "free will," He presumably would have just made it impossible to even think of violating the whatever laws He'd deem important. > (omniscient), and everywhere at once (omnipresent), you can basically > disprove anything about God being a god, because he violates all > three of these under numerous circumstances. Namely? Then again, /able/ and /willing/ are two different things, are they not? Or do you also imply at least /benevolence/ here? > The only way for God to comply with all three is if God is the > Universe itself. As far as I can tell, the Christian view is that God exists outside this Universe. (Apart from those few decades some 20 centuries ago.) As such, it's debatable if even our understanding of space and time itself is of any import to the discussions regarding God. -- FSF associate member #7257 np. Constellations -- Resonantwaves B6A0 230E 334A |
| Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk>: Aug 26 02:12PM +0100 On 26/08/17 13:12, Ivan Shmakov wrote: > suggested by Richard Heathfield (news:onpsfd$k26$1@dont-email.me.) > Please consider dropping the no longer (well, kind of) relevant > Newsgroups: when following-up. Followup-To: set to a.r.c - please subscribe to that group rather than continue with the cross-posting. > (Let's see if this approach leads anywhere.) You'd be better off starting a new thread in a.r.c., since this one is far too messy now. It's also excessively cross-posted. The theological questions being raised are quite trivial in nature and easily addressed - but not in programming language and operating system newsgroups! -- Richard Heathfield Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk "Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999 Sig line 4 vacant - apply within |
| Mr Flibble <flibbleREMOVETHISBIT@i42.co.uk>: Aug 26 02:52PM +0100 On 26/08/2017 14:12, Richard Heathfield wrote: > The theological questions being raised are quite trivial in nature and > easily addressed - but not in programming language and operating system > newsgroups! Making the followup-to alt.religion.christianity will make no difference to the fucktard Rick C. Hodgin because he knows nobody subscribes to that newsgroup and he like to post his off topic "God" nonsense posts to technical newsgroups such as this one. /Flibble |
| Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk>: Aug 26 03:04PM +0100 > I'm cross-posting this to news:alt.religion.christianity, as > suggested by Richard Heathfield > (news:onpsfd$k26$1@dont-email.me.) RH did *not* suggest cross-posting to a.r.c!! Too late now, though. What you've done is invite a whole lot more off-topic posters here. > Please consider dropping the no longer (well, kind of) relevant > Newsgroups: when following-up. Even some quite technical posters don't know to do that, and many who do won't bother doing it. Your best options would have been: (1) Start a new thread in the target group summarising the arguments so far. This has the up or down side (it's a matter of debate) of not drawing the existing participant into the thread. (2) Post a reply to the message only to the groups where it is on-topic. By being a reply, readers (with good news readers) can go up the thread to see the history of they want to. (3) Post your reply to the existing groups setting Followup-To: alt.religion.christianity yourself. This last is the technically correct way to move a thread, but it was devised in an era when most readers used decent software and "technically correct" trumped "sociologically effective". Lots of people will either not know how to respect that header or will think it imperative that everyone *must* hear they simply devastatingly clever reply and so won't honour it. -- Ben. |
| Chris Vine <chris@cvine--nospam--.freeserve.co.uk>: Aug 26 03:39PM +0100 On Sat, 26 Aug 2017 05:19:20 -0400 > Rick's not the first stubbornly religious individual I've met in my > life. I just want Rick to actually /THINK/ deeply about some of these > things he says, not just accept them because it's part of his Faith. I just want you to shut up and stop posting off topic crap on this newsgroup. Even if you are not a religious obsessive (and you may well be), your postings encourage those who are. Your postings also shows a rank disregard for the readers of this newsgroup. If you want to encourage others to think, please do it elsewhere. For example, instead of engaging in an ego trip on this newsgroup, send your intended recipient an email, since he has been good enough to provide his address. |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Aug 26 10:49AM -0700 Each of you has Christian friends, or live somewhere with access to Christian churches. Go to those people and ask them explicitly this: "Is there anyone here who is truly born again?" And then go to that person / those people and ask them to teach you personally these things I'm teaching you. Go to them and ask them questions interactively and find out from their own mouths, and their own unique experiences and backgrounds this information I'm teaching you. Do not rely upon me or my advice. I give a single testimony, which in and of itself is not to be trusted. But if you go to more than just me, and go to two or three or five or 30 people, and they all reveal to you the same general teaching and explanation about what happened to them ... then you must take it more seriously. ----- I urge each of you, with everything within me, go and see for your- self. Go and see if these things I've been teaching you are the truth or not. Go and see the lives changed by the born again nature which comes when you ask forgiveness for your sin. You'll feel a weight come off you like you've been paroled from prison or something. It will be the most amazing change in your life, and God and His angels will be with you from that time for- ward, but the enemy will also show up and try to derail your walk. A lot of born again people go through the immediate change and everything in their lives is undone and submitted to God, and they change top-to-bottom very quickly, but then the enemy comes and begins to exert influence into their flesh again, trying to take their eyes off a focus on the spirit, and put it on the flesh. Satan can only operate against your flesh by using his spiritual input and tempting. He cannot operate against you in spirit, so if you will stay focused on God in spirit and in truth, and read and study the Bible (for the words Jesus gave us ARE spirit and truth), then will you be on the right path, and you will be prosperous in service to His Kingdom. ----- Go and see from other sources who identify as being born again their testimony. Examine also their life to make sure their behavior aligns with someone who is a born again person. If you examine the fruit of their life you will know if they are legit, or a pretender. Pretenders can appear holy for a time, but there will be signs which reveal their true nature. And legitimately born again individuals will seek holiness continually, even if they occasionally do something which is not in line with what they want to do in their life's focus, but you will see that person quickly regroup, apologize, repent, and re-double their future efforts so as to not make that mistake again. You will see within them genuine remorse, and feelings of guilt to the point of weeping over what they did. These things bear evidence of the born again nature, along with major changes in a person's life. ----- Go and seek from others. Ask them. Interview them. Question them. Demand from them to know the truth about the change that occurred within them. And then in your quite solitude, ask God to reveal the truth to you. BEAR IN MIND THIS EXACT FACT: I am ONLY asking you to seek the truth. When you are in your quiet solitude, even be willing to question God over this: "God, I do not know if you are real or not, or if Christianity is real or not, or if Jesus lived as my savior or not, but what I do want to know is the truth. I want to not be deceived by any enemy which may exist, but I want to know the full truth. This is my sincere desire." If you can get to that place for real, then God will know this and He will do the rest in your life. And I should also warn you: You will never be the same again. When a person asks forgiveness for real from Jesus Christ, the spirit nature asserts itself and you are literally forever a completely new creation in Christ. You will be amazed at the change. Daily. |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Aug 26 11:34AM -0700 Do you all realize why I post these things? I'm trying to teach you the path to eternal life. I'm trying to teach you that there's an active enemy, conscious and alive, at work in this world examining you in your life, adapting his attack strategy to try and keep you from coming to that knowledge of the path to eternal life. I'm trying to teach you that you are more than this flesh, and that our lives go on after we leave this world, and there are only two destinations: (1) Heaven, (2) Hell fire. I want you all to be in Heaven, but unless you come to Jesus and ask forgiveness for your sin YOU WILL WIND UP in Hell fire. ----- My sole intention is your soul in eternity. I want you to enter eternity alive and thriving and shining and free from the limits of this flesh-based sinful material-world existence, and to be a part of God's Kingdom, even having fellowship with God Almighty, the one true God, the sole Creator of all things, face-to-face. These are God's revelations through the Bible about our relationship with Him, that He makes possible for us through His Son. He teaches that all who come to Him will not be cast away, but that all who do come to Him seeking the truth will be saved. ----- Seek the truth. Ask Jesus to forgive your sin and you will today, this very moment, pass from death to life in eternity, and you will see the change manifest in your life ... in most unexpected ways. And again I reiterate: DO NOT TAKE MY WORD FOR IT!!! Go and seek and ask other people who are born again. Find out from them the truth. Ask them questions. Question them fully. Examine their responses with scrutiny. Leave no stone unturned in your pursuit of the truth! Do this ... and God will do the rest, because He loves you and He wants to save you. It's why He sends men and women like me into your lives ... so you can have a chance to hear the gospel message (the word "gospel" means "good news" by the way). Love you, Rick C. Hodgin |
| Mr Flibble <flibbleREMOVETHISBIT@i42.co.uk>: Aug 26 09:53PM +0100 On 26/08/2017 19:34, Rick C. Hodgin wrote: > Do you all realize why I post these things? > I'm trying to teach you the path to eternal life. "Teach" is the wrong word: you are preaching not teaching and preaching and teaching are not the same thing. Now fuck off you egregious cunt. /Flibble |
| "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com>: Aug 26 02:06PM -0700 On Saturday, August 26, 2017 at 4:54:16 PM UTC-4, Mr Flibble wrote: > > I'm trying to teach you the path to eternal life. > "Teach" is the wrong word: you are preaching not teaching and > preaching and teaching are not the same thing. Agreed. Preaching and teaching are not the same thing. I am teaching you the path to eternal life (asking Jesus to forgive your sin). This teaching happens to be the same material you would hear in a Bible-believing Christian church. Still, I am not preaching. I am teaching. I am willing to entertain questions, and correct the mistakes made by people who reply in error. It is not preaching. It is teaching. And they are different. Thank you, Rick C. Hodgin |
| Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net>: Aug 26 03:15PM +1000 On 26/08/17 07:53, Alf P. Steinbach wrote: >> I'm still a bit of a newb with templates. > The ODR has a special rule for static members of class templates. > You can define that member in the header file. The header file does not define the template instance, so it cannot define the array. What's the point of having a template if you have to redefine its members for each instance? Thanks, I'll find another way to do it. Clifford Heath. |
| Kalle Olavi Niemitalo <kon@iki.fi>: Aug 26 08:50AM +0300 > The header file does not define the template instance, > so it cannot define the array. template <int unused> constexpr unsigned char Base<unused>::lengths[]; |
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